Adults Acting Like Teenagers: Freelee & Durianrider's "Legacy" in Veganism.
12 January 2017 [link youtube]
This video opens with a facepalm: we're talking about fully grown men engaging in defamation just to get attention (no, Jeff Nelson is not the only one). Vegans have to start thinking about the future of the movement, and behaving in a manner that can build the movement: there's a difference between debate and defamation, and some degree of "due diligence" is necessary before you slander people on the internet. You don't have to respect me to realize this: you can have some respect for yourself, and some concern for the future of the movement.
Youtube Automatic Transcription
ultimately people like freelee and
durianrider were most influential just in presenting all of their followers with a model of middle aged people behaving like teenagers because at bottom that's what they are and I think most you guys like including redneck to vegan even if you don't realize it even if you don't think consciously that you're imitating freelee and durianrider when you turn on the camera that's what you're doing and that's what has got to stop you can disrespect me but I'm asking you to have some respect for yourself stop behaving like a teenager and start thinking about the future of the movement but just in passing with no justification with no reason when next to vegan here if you think about what's thrown in in passing he calls me egotistical narcissistic braggadocious and he calls me a liar many many times you know apart from the much more serious things what have I lied about let me ask you really serious I have more than 500 videos on this channel they are painfully honest what have I lied about why are we members of a movement where middle aged people not teenagers so lightly so casually call each other liars why do so many of my fellow vegans behave like teenagers on the Internet hahaha implicit in that question is the fact that I'm not talking about teenagers I'm sometimes talking about men in their 40s men in their 50s we're talking about fully grown adults and you know a lot of people ask and a sort of exasperated over-the-top way why can't we just get along why can't we just patch up our differences or or differences why can't we just be friends for the sake of the movement part of that answer you've heard me say a million times on this channel part of it is that the movement right now doesn't really exist you're talking about getting over your problems for the sake of an ideal for the sake of the future possibility of having a real movement but we don't have that now we don't have that yet so that's that's part of the problem and I think if we did have a real movement you might see some more of that kind of sacrifice and reconciliation going on but you know there are other aspects to it nobody seems to be interested in reconciling now kick off I mean I think this is simple enough you guys are familiar enough with the territory that I can just launch into a couple of examples here and then and then wrap up there is another British kid with a mask who uses the name vegan foot soldier and like so many others he has made serious defamatory remarks about me and for no reason you know now I mean just to stick with one example saying that I'm a scam artist saying that I've lied to people or that I stole the money raised in a fundraiser that is serious defamation and under Canadian law of a defamation it's you can be prosecuted and in the strictest legal sense because it's a type of defamation that directly impacts my future earnings now what do I mean you guys probably know this I'm getting a children's book published I'm getting it Illustrated and published now I've had really good news about that just in the last couple of days yesterday I was talking to a team of professional illustrators people who really have experience in the industry and they were so confident that book would be a hit they were so confident that if published the book would be a hit that they were not asking me for money up front at all which was really surreal like these guys are pros these are guys who illustrated children's cartoons but you know especially like the boxes like the box for a cartoon the cover art for video games and cartoons and stuff to the other pros they've done books that are all kinds of stuff and the first question they asked me was will it be a series of three books or more I was like you know there are sons their translation errors so I like thought maybe they misunderstood me or something but no and then later on they reiterated the question they were like oh like we assume you're gonna copyright the main character like you're gonna register the main characters of trademark so you can have a whole series spun off from this book they were so confident this book is going to be a hit that that's the stuff they're talking about in like first meetings Wow so the the Chinese version of the text I mean again it's I wrote it in Chinese and translated it into English a lot of Chinese people are really really impressed with the the Chinese text now some of you will say these people are just bullshitting me but they're not I mean that's just say cuz I know the whole context they wouldn't gain anything by bullshitting me they would gain something by lying the other way they would gain something by saying to me that they think the book is not gonna make any money therefore I need to pay upfront and that's not what they're doing they're doing the opposite so and also hey they may just be recklessly optimistic but it's sincere anyway with this kind of defamation you know if you're saying that I lie to people on the Internet in a fundraiser that impacts my ability to do fundraisers in the future and for veganism as a movement I really would like to do fundraisers in the future and you know it could be a fundraiser to help a particular bear in the forest it could be for a legal fund it could be for publishing a book it could be to attend a conference or host a conference we have a beautiful situation here into Hong we have a vegan hotel we could have a vegan conference here within this year a couple months from now we could have people fly in and you know stay at this gorgeous hotel on a gorgeous plate I don't know but there are all kinds of reasons why I wouldn't want to do fundraising so I don't see how I mean these people they play dumb I don't see how they can fail to realize the seriousness of this kind of defamation now I wrote a comment to footsoldier here they're going to read out vegan foot soldier who again is a man in a mask this is an act we've before who seems to so readily resort to defaming and insulting people for no clear reason the first thing I said to him in this comment was because he's also criticizing vegan cheetah for being immoral I said to him if you want to look down on cheetah you have to actually be better than cheetah I'll just pause the comment I've said similar things to so many of my fellow youtubers there was one female on YouTube she's still on YouTube who was giving health advice and really competing with freely and I respect that game recognize game I can respect what you're doing but I said to her look if you want to be better than freely you have to actually be better than freely now whether that's through getting a degree in nutrition a degree as a dietician or you know working with you know footnote in peer-reviewed sources whatever it is you have to clearly differentiate yourself what your moral code is or what your quote qualification is you can't just say you're better than freely and therefore be better than freely you have to actually be better than freely and that might require going back to university for four years but if you're serious about this game you'll do it if that's what you want to do if you want to earn your living giving vegan weight loss advice on the Internet maybe you got to open up a [ __ ] book maybe you got to get a university diploma right anyway so I say to this guy foot soldier if you want to look down on cheetah you have to actually be better than cheetah do research before you make statements show some sensitivity for the facts show some sensitivity for your fellow human beings especially if they are in fact trying to sincerely contribute toward the future of veganism there's no reason why you and I shouldn't be mutually supportive just as to vegans etc but you've been a belligerent toward me for no good reason apparently just because you thought it would get you the attention of the crowd the same as cheetah you have a choice I would have gladly talked to you showed you legal documents etc the same way I talk to for example clothes of plant-based news if you'd shown any curiosity in the court case or in anything else that interested you from my channel just because you are a fellow vegan I would have shown you this level of cooperation and mutual respect yeah just pause close actually didn't ask me about that he didn't interrogate me about whether or not the court case is real I was having a conversation with Klaus and just in passing like we were talking about other topics in passing I mentioned like oh yeah and I've still got this nightmare going on with the court case I mentioned some details about what's going on with the court case in passing and I remember clothes just like interrupted the conversation and said look I want to apologize to you look I apologize for having said in the past that the court case wasn't real or something but he could have Emil any of these people you know if you want to know what not the court case is real for one thing the information is already on my youtube channel I think at this point you can probably google it and find legal documents or their information but if you want to know you could ask and asking is different from defaming right it's none of these people including vegan Aviva and other people none of them have ever the people of defame me on this they have shown as it just said no sensitivity to the facts and notes that no sensitivity the fact there are the real human beings involved here right I went through this experience not too long ago where um you know I was just applying for jobs I was applying for jobs in Japan it's fine for jobs in Canada applied for a couple jobs in Europe and I got none of them some of them I got interviews for or what have you now you know that's that's the experience most people have most of the time eventually I got one job it's the job I have now in China simplifying a pretty complicated story when I say that actually but I did eventually find a job you go through that and you know what's about you on the internet you know what people are gonna find if they google your name and look into what's going on with you on the internet and know having people say that you're a scam artist that you've querido financial fraud that is serious defamation that could impact you trying to get a job as I mentioned earlier could impact you trying to do fundraising for veganism and on some level any of these people if you have ever watched five of my videos at random five of my videos any of them you wouldn't know what kind of guy I am like somebody like durianrider is telling lies on the internet all the time and you can say that's just trolling you can say that's just entertainment you can say wherever the [ __ ] you want to say about it but a lie is a lie alright my channel is not like that and in terms of both the content of what I'm saying and the motivation for it if you watch any five videos at random on my channel you would know why I'm taking the time and effort why I'm talking about veganism and it's very obviously not you know be a scandal longer or something I'm yeah I be I think even if you watch the five worst videos on my channel randomly but you know if it's a random selection you would have some sense of who I am and why I'm doing this and it's just so bizarrely disconnected from this kind of treatment I get from my fellow vegans right but the treatment being mean-spirited defamation defamation paired with really just attempts to hurt my feelings so it is you're not trying to make the vegan movement better you're not trying to improve things you're not trying to do better than me you're not trying to lead it in a different direction this is not like a debate between me and Gary France aione or something you're just trying to show everyone how mean-spirited and witty you are in defaming someone and putting them down be a very different thing if someone were you know criticizing me or insulting me for some of those other reasons but all right um I continue okay so I say to him you behave toward me in a way that you would describe as pernicious yourself a word you use in this video such as pause he used the word pernicious to describe the young cheetahs conduct toward others pernicious defamation and insults um okay if you want to be better than cheetah you have to actually but be and cheetah this guy he behaved in the same way towards me right soso you behaved to meet Hawk toward me you behaved toward me in a way that you would describe as pernicious yourself from day one unprovoked creating controversy for controversies sake you're not aware of it but you're really doing the same thing as cheetah here is it about the animals or what is it about the future of the movement or what foot soldier you are just as bad as cheetah in some respects you've defamed me falsely claimed that I was running a scam without looking at any of the facts and of course without even asking me for no reason other than wanting attention you play the same game as cheetah by the same rules okay so all the aspects mentioned here are a problem you know the defamation is a problem the mean-spiritedness is a problem the inability of vegans to cooperate with other vegans to actually build a movement for the future they're all problems now look I don't need to get into it in detail but you know looking at the comments that redneck - vegan made against me so again these people are not teenagers these are basically middle-aged men these are fully grown adults I don't know how old redneck - vegan is he looks about 45 he could be 40 - he could be 55 I don't know but I mean he is a fully grown man he is not a teenager and you have to ask why do these people behave like teenagers why what's in it for them it's not good for the movement it's not good for them personally it's just this habit of mine people seem to get into on the Internet of trying to make an exhibition of how mean-spirited and Cadi they are so you know redneck TV can set a whole bunch of really mean-spirited cutting insulting things it's not that it hurts my feelings it really it hurts the future of the movement and it's gonna hurt his position in the futures movement in as much as I have anything to do about it redneck - vigan has been making videos lately saying what a nice guy he is and how morally opposed he is to drama how morally superior he is to vegan cheetah but the reality is he's been doing the same things as vegan cheetah for the same reasons as I just said redneck - vegan he's been playing the same game by the same rules now I just point out what's easy to miss so that the main thing that retina - vegan says are the most the most offensive thing or most hurtful he says he says that I'm a terrible parent she doesn't know anything about he didn't even see the videos on my channel about my parenting situation my situation my daughter I'm a terrible parents he claims that I've abandoned my daughter which is not true it's the opposite of the truth and he claims that I should be separated from my daughter it's funny how quickly you can slip from one to the other so obviously anyone would be offended by that redneck - vegan I've asked him I said how would he feel if someone said that about him it doesn't take a lot of sympathy doesn't take a lot of imagination how would he feel if the positions were reversed if he had a kid and someone out of his sheer ignorance made these kind of comments to him but you know what I wanted to mention here are actually the other forms of insult that are just thrown in so casually because to me that reflects the lack of civility and the lack of any concept of positive cooperation that has just become the norm in veganism in 2017 and you know who's to blame durianrider freely all these people on it on a fairly deep level they've just influenced our sense of normal discourse and of the purpose of the normal discourse like it's not in this guy's mind so redneck you vegan I don't know your age maybe he's 45 whatever fully grown man right fully grown middle-aged man he's a school teacher when he sees me on the Internet it doesn't even enter his mind that I'm someone he could be cooperating with and collaborating with you know real political movement called veganism though I'm somebody he could be cooperating with the same way I'm cooperating now with mod vegan or something as a mature adult this is not about teenagers acting like teenagers the problem I'm addressing this video is middle-aged people behaving like he news he's not thinking right next if he can his thinking about even five years in the future let alone 10 years right where are you gonna be five years from now if you're 45 now you're gonna be 50 are you gonna be part of a movement making a difference in the world or are you gonna be an old nutter defaming people on the Internet what do you what direction you want to take this in and if you don't look at somebody like me and see somebody cooperate with where are you even looking to cooperate where are you looking to build this this movement in the future you know when we in passing I mean I just say our sense of normal discourse the level of insult defamation bad language everything you know you see that with somebody like Jeff Nelson - and so why didn't Jeff Nelson look at me and say oh here's a serious middle-aged man I'm 38 identify his middle age here's a serious middle-aged man with a degree in political science political push to veganism trying to get things organized there was just no reason for Jeff Nelson to come at me with the level of hostility he had completely unprovoked day one but Jeff Nelson is an old man who still thinks like a teenager who still behaves like a teenager on the Internet but just in passing with no justification with no reason redneck - vigan here if you think about what's thrown in in passing he calls me egotistical narcissistic braggadocious and he calls me a liar many many times you know apart from the much more serious things um what have I lied about let me ask you really serious I have more than 500 videos on this channel they are painfully honest what have I lied about why are we members of a movement where middle-aged people not teenagers so lightly so casually call each other liars okay I believe that durianrider is lying you when he claims that he cured Crohn's disease and I had videos explaining very clearly why that is including the fact that I play for you an audio clip in which he says he never was diagnosed with Crohn's disease now there are other videos in which he says he was diagnosed with Crohn's disease there are other videos in which he says he can prove that he cured Crohn's disease through his blood tests although in fact the test for Crohn's disease is not a blood test look it up people um sorry I'll try to improve the lighting here a little bit you know I did not casually or lightly or in a stupid shallow insulting way called durianrider a liar it was very clear what liya was talking about and while I was talking about it I wasn't just raking mud for the sake of raking mud for me this is about the future of the movement for me this is about the real consequences in people's lives when they put their faith in someone who's a major leader in the movement who's lying to you about health information about he's lying to you but so many things including when he lies defaming others when he makes serious criminal accusations against other people alright I'm not doing this for the sake of my ego I'm not doing this just to show how mean-spirited and Cadi I can be in a comment section all right it is this about ecology or not is this about the animals or not is this about the future of our culture and civilization or not either it's about the movement or it's just [ __ ] and if you have made it to 30 years old I don't care if you're wearing a mask I don't care if you're wearing a frock I don't care if you're wearing a tutu I don't care what [ __ ] you're doing to draw attention you on the Internet have some sensitivity for the facts and have some sensitivity for the fact that these are real human including me who really have to take their resume and go in and apply for a job who really had their heart in their line why would you so casually call me a liar the whole problem is that this is my real life I'm sharing with you I'm not the one wearing a mask here and I'm not the one defaming other people you don't have to respect it you don't I'm not asking anyone to respect me you want to criticize me on any of these matters of substance have at it lay into me you want to spew with me vivisection castrating dogs whether or not pigs should be pets a status of hunting wild animals what if there are million great things to debate I just did a book review read the same book do a better book review say that I was dead wrong I misinterpret the book fine talk about matters of substance whatever right but I mean ultimately people like freelee and durianrider were most influential just in presenting all of their followers with a model of middle aged people behaving like teenagers because at bottom that's what they are and I think most you guys like including redneck to vegan even if you don't realize it even if you don't think consciously that you're imitating freelee and durianrider when you turn on the camera that's what you're doing and that's what has got to stop you can disrespect me but I'm asking you to have some respect for yourself stop behaving like a teenager and start thinking about the future of the movement
durianrider were most influential just in presenting all of their followers with a model of middle aged people behaving like teenagers because at bottom that's what they are and I think most you guys like including redneck to vegan even if you don't realize it even if you don't think consciously that you're imitating freelee and durianrider when you turn on the camera that's what you're doing and that's what has got to stop you can disrespect me but I'm asking you to have some respect for yourself stop behaving like a teenager and start thinking about the future of the movement but just in passing with no justification with no reason when next to vegan here if you think about what's thrown in in passing he calls me egotistical narcissistic braggadocious and he calls me a liar many many times you know apart from the much more serious things what have I lied about let me ask you really serious I have more than 500 videos on this channel they are painfully honest what have I lied about why are we members of a movement where middle aged people not teenagers so lightly so casually call each other liars why do so many of my fellow vegans behave like teenagers on the Internet hahaha implicit in that question is the fact that I'm not talking about teenagers I'm sometimes talking about men in their 40s men in their 50s we're talking about fully grown adults and you know a lot of people ask and a sort of exasperated over-the-top way why can't we just get along why can't we just patch up our differences or or differences why can't we just be friends for the sake of the movement part of that answer you've heard me say a million times on this channel part of it is that the movement right now doesn't really exist you're talking about getting over your problems for the sake of an ideal for the sake of the future possibility of having a real movement but we don't have that now we don't have that yet so that's that's part of the problem and I think if we did have a real movement you might see some more of that kind of sacrifice and reconciliation going on but you know there are other aspects to it nobody seems to be interested in reconciling now kick off I mean I think this is simple enough you guys are familiar enough with the territory that I can just launch into a couple of examples here and then and then wrap up there is another British kid with a mask who uses the name vegan foot soldier and like so many others he has made serious defamatory remarks about me and for no reason you know now I mean just to stick with one example saying that I'm a scam artist saying that I've lied to people or that I stole the money raised in a fundraiser that is serious defamation and under Canadian law of a defamation it's you can be prosecuted and in the strictest legal sense because it's a type of defamation that directly impacts my future earnings now what do I mean you guys probably know this I'm getting a children's book published I'm getting it Illustrated and published now I've had really good news about that just in the last couple of days yesterday I was talking to a team of professional illustrators people who really have experience in the industry and they were so confident that book would be a hit they were so confident that if published the book would be a hit that they were not asking me for money up front at all which was really surreal like these guys are pros these are guys who illustrated children's cartoons but you know especially like the boxes like the box for a cartoon the cover art for video games and cartoons and stuff to the other pros they've done books that are all kinds of stuff and the first question they asked me was will it be a series of three books or more I was like you know there are sons their translation errors so I like thought maybe they misunderstood me or something but no and then later on they reiterated the question they were like oh like we assume you're gonna copyright the main character like you're gonna register the main characters of trademark so you can have a whole series spun off from this book they were so confident this book is going to be a hit that that's the stuff they're talking about in like first meetings Wow so the the Chinese version of the text I mean again it's I wrote it in Chinese and translated it into English a lot of Chinese people are really really impressed with the the Chinese text now some of you will say these people are just bullshitting me but they're not I mean that's just say cuz I know the whole context they wouldn't gain anything by bullshitting me they would gain something by lying the other way they would gain something by saying to me that they think the book is not gonna make any money therefore I need to pay upfront and that's not what they're doing they're doing the opposite so and also hey they may just be recklessly optimistic but it's sincere anyway with this kind of defamation you know if you're saying that I lie to people on the Internet in a fundraiser that impacts my ability to do fundraisers in the future and for veganism as a movement I really would like to do fundraisers in the future and you know it could be a fundraiser to help a particular bear in the forest it could be for a legal fund it could be for publishing a book it could be to attend a conference or host a conference we have a beautiful situation here into Hong we have a vegan hotel we could have a vegan conference here within this year a couple months from now we could have people fly in and you know stay at this gorgeous hotel on a gorgeous plate I don't know but there are all kinds of reasons why I wouldn't want to do fundraising so I don't see how I mean these people they play dumb I don't see how they can fail to realize the seriousness of this kind of defamation now I wrote a comment to footsoldier here they're going to read out vegan foot soldier who again is a man in a mask this is an act we've before who seems to so readily resort to defaming and insulting people for no clear reason the first thing I said to him in this comment was because he's also criticizing vegan cheetah for being immoral I said to him if you want to look down on cheetah you have to actually be better than cheetah I'll just pause the comment I've said similar things to so many of my fellow youtubers there was one female on YouTube she's still on YouTube who was giving health advice and really competing with freely and I respect that game recognize game I can respect what you're doing but I said to her look if you want to be better than freely you have to actually be better than freely now whether that's through getting a degree in nutrition a degree as a dietician or you know working with you know footnote in peer-reviewed sources whatever it is you have to clearly differentiate yourself what your moral code is or what your quote qualification is you can't just say you're better than freely and therefore be better than freely you have to actually be better than freely and that might require going back to university for four years but if you're serious about this game you'll do it if that's what you want to do if you want to earn your living giving vegan weight loss advice on the Internet maybe you got to open up a [ __ ] book maybe you got to get a university diploma right anyway so I say to this guy foot soldier if you want to look down on cheetah you have to actually be better than cheetah do research before you make statements show some sensitivity for the facts show some sensitivity for your fellow human beings especially if they are in fact trying to sincerely contribute toward the future of veganism there's no reason why you and I shouldn't be mutually supportive just as to vegans etc but you've been a belligerent toward me for no good reason apparently just because you thought it would get you the attention of the crowd the same as cheetah you have a choice I would have gladly talked to you showed you legal documents etc the same way I talk to for example clothes of plant-based news if you'd shown any curiosity in the court case or in anything else that interested you from my channel just because you are a fellow vegan I would have shown you this level of cooperation and mutual respect yeah just pause close actually didn't ask me about that he didn't interrogate me about whether or not the court case is real I was having a conversation with Klaus and just in passing like we were talking about other topics in passing I mentioned like oh yeah and I've still got this nightmare going on with the court case I mentioned some details about what's going on with the court case in passing and I remember clothes just like interrupted the conversation and said look I want to apologize to you look I apologize for having said in the past that the court case wasn't real or something but he could have Emil any of these people you know if you want to know what not the court case is real for one thing the information is already on my youtube channel I think at this point you can probably google it and find legal documents or their information but if you want to know you could ask and asking is different from defaming right it's none of these people including vegan Aviva and other people none of them have ever the people of defame me on this they have shown as it just said no sensitivity to the facts and notes that no sensitivity the fact there are the real human beings involved here right I went through this experience not too long ago where um you know I was just applying for jobs I was applying for jobs in Japan it's fine for jobs in Canada applied for a couple jobs in Europe and I got none of them some of them I got interviews for or what have you now you know that's that's the experience most people have most of the time eventually I got one job it's the job I have now in China simplifying a pretty complicated story when I say that actually but I did eventually find a job you go through that and you know what's about you on the internet you know what people are gonna find if they google your name and look into what's going on with you on the internet and know having people say that you're a scam artist that you've querido financial fraud that is serious defamation that could impact you trying to get a job as I mentioned earlier could impact you trying to do fundraising for veganism and on some level any of these people if you have ever watched five of my videos at random five of my videos any of them you wouldn't know what kind of guy I am like somebody like durianrider is telling lies on the internet all the time and you can say that's just trolling you can say that's just entertainment you can say wherever the [ __ ] you want to say about it but a lie is a lie alright my channel is not like that and in terms of both the content of what I'm saying and the motivation for it if you watch any five videos at random on my channel you would know why I'm taking the time and effort why I'm talking about veganism and it's very obviously not you know be a scandal longer or something I'm yeah I be I think even if you watch the five worst videos on my channel randomly but you know if it's a random selection you would have some sense of who I am and why I'm doing this and it's just so bizarrely disconnected from this kind of treatment I get from my fellow vegans right but the treatment being mean-spirited defamation defamation paired with really just attempts to hurt my feelings so it is you're not trying to make the vegan movement better you're not trying to improve things you're not trying to do better than me you're not trying to lead it in a different direction this is not like a debate between me and Gary France aione or something you're just trying to show everyone how mean-spirited and witty you are in defaming someone and putting them down be a very different thing if someone were you know criticizing me or insulting me for some of those other reasons but all right um I continue okay so I say to him you behave toward me in a way that you would describe as pernicious yourself a word you use in this video such as pause he used the word pernicious to describe the young cheetahs conduct toward others pernicious defamation and insults um okay if you want to be better than cheetah you have to actually but be and cheetah this guy he behaved in the same way towards me right soso you behaved to meet Hawk toward me you behaved toward me in a way that you would describe as pernicious yourself from day one unprovoked creating controversy for controversies sake you're not aware of it but you're really doing the same thing as cheetah here is it about the animals or what is it about the future of the movement or what foot soldier you are just as bad as cheetah in some respects you've defamed me falsely claimed that I was running a scam without looking at any of the facts and of course without even asking me for no reason other than wanting attention you play the same game as cheetah by the same rules okay so all the aspects mentioned here are a problem you know the defamation is a problem the mean-spiritedness is a problem the inability of vegans to cooperate with other vegans to actually build a movement for the future they're all problems now look I don't need to get into it in detail but you know looking at the comments that redneck - vegan made against me so again these people are not teenagers these are basically middle-aged men these are fully grown adults I don't know how old redneck - vegan is he looks about 45 he could be 40 - he could be 55 I don't know but I mean he is a fully grown man he is not a teenager and you have to ask why do these people behave like teenagers why what's in it for them it's not good for the movement it's not good for them personally it's just this habit of mine people seem to get into on the Internet of trying to make an exhibition of how mean-spirited and Cadi they are so you know redneck TV can set a whole bunch of really mean-spirited cutting insulting things it's not that it hurts my feelings it really it hurts the future of the movement and it's gonna hurt his position in the futures movement in as much as I have anything to do about it redneck - vigan has been making videos lately saying what a nice guy he is and how morally opposed he is to drama how morally superior he is to vegan cheetah but the reality is he's been doing the same things as vegan cheetah for the same reasons as I just said redneck - vegan he's been playing the same game by the same rules now I just point out what's easy to miss so that the main thing that retina - vegan says are the most the most offensive thing or most hurtful he says he says that I'm a terrible parent she doesn't know anything about he didn't even see the videos on my channel about my parenting situation my situation my daughter I'm a terrible parents he claims that I've abandoned my daughter which is not true it's the opposite of the truth and he claims that I should be separated from my daughter it's funny how quickly you can slip from one to the other so obviously anyone would be offended by that redneck - vegan I've asked him I said how would he feel if someone said that about him it doesn't take a lot of sympathy doesn't take a lot of imagination how would he feel if the positions were reversed if he had a kid and someone out of his sheer ignorance made these kind of comments to him but you know what I wanted to mention here are actually the other forms of insult that are just thrown in so casually because to me that reflects the lack of civility and the lack of any concept of positive cooperation that has just become the norm in veganism in 2017 and you know who's to blame durianrider freely all these people on it on a fairly deep level they've just influenced our sense of normal discourse and of the purpose of the normal discourse like it's not in this guy's mind so redneck you vegan I don't know your age maybe he's 45 whatever fully grown man right fully grown middle-aged man he's a school teacher when he sees me on the Internet it doesn't even enter his mind that I'm someone he could be cooperating with and collaborating with you know real political movement called veganism though I'm somebody he could be cooperating with the same way I'm cooperating now with mod vegan or something as a mature adult this is not about teenagers acting like teenagers the problem I'm addressing this video is middle-aged people behaving like he news he's not thinking right next if he can his thinking about even five years in the future let alone 10 years right where are you gonna be five years from now if you're 45 now you're gonna be 50 are you gonna be part of a movement making a difference in the world or are you gonna be an old nutter defaming people on the Internet what do you what direction you want to take this in and if you don't look at somebody like me and see somebody cooperate with where are you even looking to cooperate where are you looking to build this this movement in the future you know when we in passing I mean I just say our sense of normal discourse the level of insult defamation bad language everything you know you see that with somebody like Jeff Nelson - and so why didn't Jeff Nelson look at me and say oh here's a serious middle-aged man I'm 38 identify his middle age here's a serious middle-aged man with a degree in political science political push to veganism trying to get things organized there was just no reason for Jeff Nelson to come at me with the level of hostility he had completely unprovoked day one but Jeff Nelson is an old man who still thinks like a teenager who still behaves like a teenager on the Internet but just in passing with no justification with no reason redneck - vigan here if you think about what's thrown in in passing he calls me egotistical narcissistic braggadocious and he calls me a liar many many times you know apart from the much more serious things um what have I lied about let me ask you really serious I have more than 500 videos on this channel they are painfully honest what have I lied about why are we members of a movement where middle-aged people not teenagers so lightly so casually call each other liars okay I believe that durianrider is lying you when he claims that he cured Crohn's disease and I had videos explaining very clearly why that is including the fact that I play for you an audio clip in which he says he never was diagnosed with Crohn's disease now there are other videos in which he says he was diagnosed with Crohn's disease there are other videos in which he says he can prove that he cured Crohn's disease through his blood tests although in fact the test for Crohn's disease is not a blood test look it up people um sorry I'll try to improve the lighting here a little bit you know I did not casually or lightly or in a stupid shallow insulting way called durianrider a liar it was very clear what liya was talking about and while I was talking about it I wasn't just raking mud for the sake of raking mud for me this is about the future of the movement for me this is about the real consequences in people's lives when they put their faith in someone who's a major leader in the movement who's lying to you about health information about he's lying to you but so many things including when he lies defaming others when he makes serious criminal accusations against other people alright I'm not doing this for the sake of my ego I'm not doing this just to show how mean-spirited and Cadi I can be in a comment section all right it is this about ecology or not is this about the animals or not is this about the future of our culture and civilization or not either it's about the movement or it's just [ __ ] and if you have made it to 30 years old I don't care if you're wearing a mask I don't care if you're wearing a frock I don't care if you're wearing a tutu I don't care what [ __ ] you're doing to draw attention you on the Internet have some sensitivity for the facts and have some sensitivity for the fact that these are real human including me who really have to take their resume and go in and apply for a job who really had their heart in their line why would you so casually call me a liar the whole problem is that this is my real life I'm sharing with you I'm not the one wearing a mask here and I'm not the one defaming other people you don't have to respect it you don't I'm not asking anyone to respect me you want to criticize me on any of these matters of substance have at it lay into me you want to spew with me vivisection castrating dogs whether or not pigs should be pets a status of hunting wild animals what if there are million great things to debate I just did a book review read the same book do a better book review say that I was dead wrong I misinterpret the book fine talk about matters of substance whatever right but I mean ultimately people like freelee and durianrider were most influential just in presenting all of their followers with a model of middle aged people behaving like teenagers because at bottom that's what they are and I think most you guys like including redneck to vegan even if you don't realize it even if you don't think consciously that you're imitating freelee and durianrider when you turn on the camera that's what you're doing and that's what has got to stop you can disrespect me but I'm asking you to have some respect for yourself stop behaving like a teenager and start thinking about the future of the movement