Street Protest vs. Stand Up Comedy (25 min. discussion)

bonus yen I tried to volunteer to be in
the [ __ ] you know the cube of truth [ __ ] you know the trick the cube of truth [ __ ] they wouldn't they wouldn't let me do cube of truth and what told other people that they're like flabbergasted because of course all these groups are like Oh everyone's welcome welcome to participate everyone's welcome to get involved nope but some people are welcome at some heart if I do an open mic night in a comedy club I think I can really reach like 200 people in a more meaningful way than standing on a street corner in Los Angeles so that's what I'm talking about I'm talking I'm not gonna be talking about comparing street activism to something perfect I'm just talking about comparing it to like real alternatives you may have access to but I have already mentioned one of the other problems which is just the barriers to entry so for me I couldn't even participate in a silent protest the level of censor so that's a silent protest that cube of truth I wouldn't even talk I just stand there in my vegan t-shirt it's that thing that would be my job would be just to stand there holding you know a TV screen right and I couldn't do that cuz they're there whatever reason the snobs like I don't know why me I don't like I nobody told me why is it that they're too left-wing or they're too right when look why I don't know but they shut me out of participating in a silent protest if I get on stage as a stand-up comedian you know who's who's the gatekeeper who's the barrier to entry maybe the audience is gonna laugh maybe they're gonna boo you know maybe we're gonna have a good time maybe not right but that's really different right and maybe maybe I'm gonna listen to the audience maybe they're gonna talk a little too and I'm gonna respond to that and maybe I'm gonna shut them down there's there's a bit of a dynamic that way but you know when you think about it that's really question who are the gatekeepers so I know I know quest doesn't want to roll with DXE anymore so now if you want to if you want to protest who do you roll with and because again you can be a one-man protest I think it's a lot worse than being a stand-up comedian but like you guys must now be trying to compromise with somebody Mercy for Animals or some group any on each one as to what Mercy for Animals there are things that are that are messed up about them pet other things that you know you got to make different compromises teach these groups right [Music] [Music] Banas yen hey sorry so I mentor I'm interrupting a social evening evidently ya hear that stuff the antler the whole antler restaurant Oh No so there's a restaurant that specializes in deer meat or sling coal antler I'm guessing or what one thing those video that went pretty viral the UM the owner came to the to the front of the window and started butchering like a deer laying over trying the act this pissed me off why not and and that one quickly viral so he was actually and it was it was a little bit shocking actually we didn't expect that except expect that protest to become some viral of all of the things they could have climbed in bird the chef and the owner of the restaurant brought out and laying if you like chopped in front of activist here's interesting story I guess because there's that a bit of a conflict this media finds it yeah what you you live yes I'll just conventionally you know like you have to live really close to this stuff in food services we've got a college that we're gonna study vegan baking at and it's a college that does special courses in plant-based cuisine plant-based cooking look they are they are sort of Pro vegan they have several vegans on staff but at the same time there's like a poster up like next month take our special class in like how to butcher a hog how to save money by like buying a whole hog and butchering it yourself you don't really these special classes and stuff of that it's on the same table it sort of same you know they do the special class unlike vegan cuisine and to do this special class and how to butcher a hog and it's like you know we've all got to get along you literally don't have a choice you know do you know you want to study vegan cuisine here great we also do classes on hog butchering you know the attention over the girl in dxd that covered herself an animal feces before now that got like no media attention rather like laying in this room fecal matter and like a little argument between store owner and it's weird its attraction on the Internet this is this is the low-hanging fruit phenomenon right like can you if you want to dump down your content to make it relevant to that kind of mass media IV that's it's a very different creative challenge no I have never even heard of it like I'm just being honest you I've never even heard of it I am well gee who do you think would have invited me to that do you think Jordan would have invited me to go that no I mean like there's not a lot of people here we saw her down the street the other day he's looking he's looking like a Ken doll he's real well he's real well manicured but yeah I bumped into George there hey man what's up hey yeah yeah you walk you walk past each other from the other time but no even at the even at the event afterwards you know I did that video with the vegan bodybuilder that's on my channel you I met him at Jordans event so I was you know it's jazz to talk to him and he was really excited to talk to me and we did this video together and Jordan came by and like stiffly shook my hand but like dude I mean you know like there's that mentality some people have the mentality like here's the pie and now we have to fight over who gets a bigger piece of the pie or they think of it as a static image of a pie and then there are people who see things productively like look every day we're making new pies like today we made 10 tomorrow we can make 100 you with me let's all start making pie like if we cooperate there can be more pie for everybody we're you're not seeing it it's like a finite amount of Phi that we got to fight over but where we got to collaborate to be more productive so there's more pie everywhere but like they would most of the time it never gets talked about but no nobody has invited me to any camp I tried to volunteer to be in the [ __ ] you know the cube of truth [ __ ] you know the trick the cube of truth [ __ ] they wouldn't they wouldn't let me do cube of truth and what told other people that they're like flabbergasted because of course all these groups are like oh everyone's welcome welcome to participate everyone's welcome to get involved nope but some people are welcome at some heart so you know like I go see they just they kicked me out of the Facebook group and then yeah I just said yeah okay I'll come because the Facebook group it's a Facebook group that only exists for that purpose to like you know show up basically you know and and some instructions about how to behave and stuff like that you know what I mean so they keep me on the Facebook group and remember I told this to this other guy Harrison Nathan I was like look man this is the reality like I don't live in Los Angeles or New York like I don't have like 10 vegan groups to choose between there are like two vegan groups here and I can't work with either one of them and then after after I skied to the Facebook Rebecca I wrote to Jordan like hey what's up and he wouldn't reply Jordan and his girlfriend wouldn't reply says like okay so got kicked out of for no reason with no explanation I'm just not welcome to attend the only the only you know form of protest vegan protest that's ongoing in my town but when I told Harrison Nathan this his response was well look man if you wanna do street protest you wouldn't let that stop you you'd go and like get your own table and get your own booth and you start like you know in a sense you're right in a sense I can I can stand there alone on the street I can be a one-man vegan protest I can I can or like right now this YouTube video more than 10 people will see it like I'm not gonna be wildly optimist here but this could have a meaningful impact this video on more people's lives than me standing on that street corner and that for me that really is the choice I've got for someone else they'll have different options and different opportunities but it's true but I mean anyway look you already knows for me I see so this will come back to my first question I see the main positive thing about protesting on the street being the other vegans I meet you know the other people who are there to protest is the viewing it as a rally viewing it as networking viewing it as you know sharing within the vegan side that I think is positive but like in terms of like my interactions with meat-eaters like yeah yes it can be I mean you know look at random you can meet people who really want to hear the message but you know you can also do things so you're not meeting people at a tran but yeah my question to you was about that the impact on your psychology and behavior if you're out there if you're out there shodhan that randoms every day between outreach and shouting oh and look you can have the conversations but it's like under the context I think what you're doing with like you you know if you're ten people and you're like hey take this leaflet you're all doing the same time it's different than you know standing like within proximity of each other and just having those conversations ask your what's the other kids Julie carb strong does a lot of that yeah you have those conversations like those can be pretty or done and I also think I don't feel at all that Street activism is a static thing I mean it is repetitive but I think there's innovation happening all the time it is like a learning process I view it personally as more of a practice like meditation like yoga like any of those things where you just keep doing it and evading you get better and better oh boy it effective so you know a lot of times we feel like we are always saying the same thing I mean there's nothing wrong with that right because there's um there's certain sort key arguments that you expect after a while well you know people questions it's not even arguments just questions about veganism but then on from our side from our perspective like we just try to become better at have seen those questions like effective and efficient allergies trying to get because I think I asked this because we doctors are also recognize that you can't do things all the time so finding finding ways to create and even though I don't static at all I think I knew I knew one example of a guy for whom it was really psychologically positive he started off with some kind of learning disability and I think it wasn't the learning disability itself but that he grew up very isolated because of his learning disability and oh that's right and as also his family background was really religious they were like Christian fundamentalist so he never really talked to anybody growing up and for him doing vegan Street activism was really like his first time talking to strangers and he went from being a very awkward person to being very confident public speaker through hundreds and hundreds of repetitions of having those same those same conversations over and over again yeah I don't know though I mean in terms of in terms of our culture I mean you know who taught who talks on the street you know if you think about the forum as opposed to renting a hall at the University as opposed to you know any other kind of conference or event where people come in and talk about politics to think about morality or something I mean the street corner is almost exclusively associated with religious fundamentalists and and crackheads and idiots right maniacs I mean you just think about the word street the term street preacher you know what I mean you're kind of starting you're kind of starting on a week basis by approaching a stranger on the street that way I'm really I'm really just saying compared to the alternatives you may have not everyone may have those those alternatives but I think strategically that's worth that's worth thinking about too right I mean you know I was involved in the theater in Toronto like you can also do politics onstage in a theater where people have bought a ticket and sit down to listen to what you have to say much more accessible because I understand you know sometimes in a in a proper in a forum where university setting you can have a more constructive dialogue happening it's pretty well facilitated and moderated whereas where the street levels know like getting really messy but at the same time you know there's it's like pros and cons both right level it's accessible oh and I I disagree I think no you kind of cherry pick a little bit there though those kind of dirty negative aspects of life people commonly associated Street those are really specific examples and yeah you know historically colorful get the word out there I think cherry picking I think share picking is inevitable to some extent cuz I do I want I do want to talk about particular examples but I don't I don't really value as the the academic side of the spectrum one of the most powerful political influences in my childhood was Chris Rock the stand-up comedian right I mean Chris Rock talks about politics on a stage and you can't say it's not inaccessible I mean he reaches the lowest common denominator but I think Chris Rock is one of the most powerful political demagogues of his generation you know this comedy today I think is less less political than it was a few decades ago because he's gotten older and you know like most comedians his material changes but like I'm gonna go to Los Angeles for about five days if I do an open mic night in a comedy club I think I can really reach like 200 people in a more meaningful way than standing on a street corner in Los Angeles so that's what I'm talking about I'm talking I'm not gonna talking about comparing Street activism to something perfect I'm just talking about comparing it to like real alternatives you may have access to and you know that's why I mentioned University exam on a university campus talking the University H people all the time anyway so just for me that's easy but I agreed there I think there are a lot of like did others mythology about how great universities are as a place to spread ideas and it's frankly it's [ __ ] but yeah sure I think that's that's the kind of question I have to ask myself you know happening States having a platform in a more control setting is not necessarily always I mean you know like ideologues and preachers write those megachurches and and things like that you know they're they're whole bunch of issues sure I think the end of the day you know having people go be just participating in political issues having political discussions at a street level or a democracy and healthy I don't but I have already mentioned one of the other problems which is just the barriers to entry so for me I couldn't even participate in a silent protest the level of censor so that's a silent protest that cube of truth I wouldn't even talk I just stand there in my vegan t-shirt it's that thing that would be my job would be just to stand there holding you know a TV screen right and I couldn't do that cuz they're there whatever reason the snobs like I don't know why me I don't like I nobody told me why is it that they're too left-wing or they're too right when look why I don't know but they shut me out of participating in a silent protest if I get on stage as a stand-up comedian you know who's who's the gatekeeper who's the barrier to entry maybe the audience is gonna laugh maybe they're gonna boo you know maybe we're gonna have a good time maybe not right but that's really different right and maybe maybe I'm gonna listen to the audience maybe they're gonna talk a little too and I'm gonna respond to that and maybe I'm gonna shut them down there's there's a bit of a dynamic that way but you know when you think about it that's really question who are the gatekeepers so I know I know Quest doesn't want to roll with DXE anymore so now if you want to if you want to protest who do you roll with and because again you can be a one-man protest I think it's a lot worse than being a stand-up comedian but like you guys must now be trying to compromise with somebody Mercy for Animals or some group any on each one as to what Mercy for Animals there are things that are that are messed up about them pedda there are things that you know you got to make different compromises teach these groups I'm all about it but like I said for me the street activism I see the positive thing as being meeting other vegans but I think if I want to talk to meet eaters I think it's gonna be stand-up comedy when I'm dead serious I was talking to the Tcat Tcat has a YouTube channel he's been going to open mic nights doing vegan stand-up comedy so he opened his set by saying yeah I'm vegan I only meat when I climb over the fence and kill my neighbor's dog for the audience who found this so offensive they thought it was racist against Asians even recision that they shut the show down he was not after he was gonna do all set a vegan come it's like you learned something from eating other vegans but like there's different forms there's like yo yo yo meat in the beginning and then you grab stock and we placed and then you go to your corner and you do your thing and you buy yourself the conversations with you and the other person that you know if you grab their attention and it can be very like very you know it's outside in the street but it's mid setting in terms of just exchanging ideas and answering questions where they don't feel like there's like a whole bunch of people listening damn we're judging them you're what they're gonna stay and if you definite enter your like sincere enough and the way you're willing to give the information and hear where they're at even more effective than having a group of people who think the little bit information busy focusing on a mass masterly conversation like you and me right here and now get a lot of each other not so I think there is sure you know um I do have that experience at some extent cuz people approached me on the street they sometimes they approached me because they know me from YouTube they're like oh that's the vegan guy but sometimes they approach me just as I'm wearing a label that says vegan like I'm wearing vegan on my sleeve or on my shirt we have this shirt right now is a vegan shirt whatever you know so people do approach me but because they're approaching me that means they want to learn or than want ask a question it's different than me like walking up to a stranger being like hey I want to talk to you about veganism the answer the answer is then probably gonna be no but I know I know you're you're saying you have these kinds of these kinds of positive experiences that's that's kind of their strategy as they wait for people they only they almost exclusively only talk to people who are interested in actually being a high percentage of almost all their conversations are much more productive and pretty much everyone who stop by and have a conversation appreciate about me it's something that's been on their mind and and having someone to talk to clarify some questions they have and then you can offer them resources to help them start going and I think that is well I agree completely I mean I think it's interesting to the cube of truth is kind of emerged as the most successful method at a time when like just two years ago there were really a lot of other methods that were more popular I think it's because people tried the other methods and then they tried cube of truth and they found exactly what you're describing my father made most of his living out of propaganda basically and one of the things he always taught people this was part of his business and the propaganda businesses part of his personal philosophy also he said you have to decide at the beginning are you aiming for informational education that was how he term it or you trying to achieve a change in attitude attitudinal education that's interesting because as vegans sometimes were trying to do both sometimes to solve one of the other right like do I really want to get this person specific facts about slaughterhouses or about ecology is that what I'm trying to get across here or am I trying to get them to ask questions or just question their own attitude so I should my dad's classic example of that was when you're teaching white people about the history of Native Americans like you can teach them the dates of specific massacres or specific incidents or how many people died of this plague or that policeman and he says no like most of this isn't really the point this isn't really what you want to get bogged down in what you want to be focused on is okay people have come in with these sets of assumptions about Native Americans to give an example they may have the assumption that all Native Americans just lived in tents that they just lived in teepees and you're trying to challenge them say hey look if you actually look at their history of architecture they lived in cities and towns they had buildings like this this is part of the history and it's not about particular facts it's about attitudes so I actually I kind of agree with you that cube of truth really works especially if it's about a confrontation with facts where it's like hey look about greenhouse gases this matters this doesn't where's putting those things in perspective guess what the greenhouse gases from meat it's way worse than you think it is I think that kind of approach can be really really useful for that but in terms of getting people to question and take on a new attitude I do think like comedians like Chris Rock you know confronting people with unexpected you know incongruous contrasts you know in his case often about race but about political questions whether related to race or not I do think that can be really effective and I do think for people who like literally never heard the word vegan before I never thought about it you know maybe stand-up comedy and those things in being positive and you know sorry quest already knows this about me sorry Fred I don't even know your name but the guy in the glasses you may not know this but you know the other form of activism I've been leaning heavily on was actually writing children's storybooks writing and then trying to get it straight and published children's storybooks that deal with the fundamental questions of veganism in a way where parents can read them to kids or a school teacher can read them to kids because it's not going to be slaughterhouse footage right it's not going to be cube of truth for children u.s. you broach those issues in a way that gets that attitudinal shift and that's obviously not it's also not gonna be hey kids here are specific facts about greenhouse gases right that's not that's not you're gonna cross that bridge yeah children's great so Oliver and they're more of them now I mean she's not the only person to me I mean there is a lot of our vegan children's literature yeah and focus books that they illustrate things and things like that and that can become I mean even more adults not just children I think even for adults stories and narratives or particle fuels or units or yeah like you said changing people's attitudes by presenting to them different perspectives in the way that they can either connect both certain emotions and an empathy very much so cool look guys uh you know I just moved back from China I need colleagues I need people to protest with so I'm not protesting alone so quest you know give this guy my email I'm gonna move to Vancouver in September anyway so maybe we can stand maybe we can stand on the same street corner in the pouring rain and do outreach review No Vancouver's got to be the worst climate for Street activism to I mean even Saskatchewan is better for Street activism but I'm trying to put together man so I am I am really happy to meet you I already know quest but I met I met one new vegan activist today which I'm really happy about and I I hope we can get in touch me some positive bonus yen