Bonny Rebecca & Vegan Gains: Stupid, Not Ugly?

a somewhat overused term in politics is
arguing in bad faith and it can be a meaningful term and can also be hackneyed and overused and meaningless a little thought experiment to ask yourself some time especially if you're being overly harsh and criticizing someone you love and someone you care about is would it actually satisfy you would it actually end the argument would end the disagreement if the person you're debating with said the exact opposite of what they're currently saying so we're here talking about bonny Rebecca and whether or not beauty and body image issues matter and veganism I think i'ma talk a little bit about vegan gains - right often enough in situations in life where I point out to people political considerations that are so unexpected that are so outside of their frame of reference in political compass that they think I'm being unreasonable and nothing they could say would would satisfy me so like if I make a statement about First Nations people and genocide and the history of the British Empire they may react and they may not really articulate at this this clearly they may react by saying look nothing is going to satisfy you you're just interested in political correctness or cultural relativism you have some agenda or you're just biased against me you're put in whatever I say about First Nations people nothing can satisfy you and no that's that's not the case actually kind of almost anything will satisfy me I'm actually open to a really broad range of kind of fablet opinions but like if the point of contention is that I say yeah what the British Empire did to indigenous people in Canada is genocide is cultural genocide and attempted outright genocide in many cases you know if if you say that also then we don't have to dispute you may have a different angle on you may have a different interpretation there may be be a range of values now for viewers of this channel that's not that shocking you can imagine many times they had conversations people about the politics of Cambodia where they're deeply shocked and can't believe what I'm telling them about the role of the United Nations in Cambodia where they really cannot bow leave when I tell them that the United States government supported communism in Cambodia that's specifically Ronald Reagan bankrolled financed and provided armaments to the most notorious communists in the world the Pol Pot faction of democratic Kampuchea normally referred to as as the Khmer Rouge so you guys are gonna be in conversation one day then wow that's so far out of left field that's so unexpected like buddy nothing I can say about Cambodia is satisfy you oh oh no actually I'm really just sharing with you an unfamiliar you know perspective and actually kind of in a sense anything you'd say was that that's not the case see see I'm saying so had a bunch of people predictably enough react I think in bad faith to what I've said about bonny Rebecca had a bunch of people react by insisting that she's really attractive sir I laugh in them though saying that because to me it's so telling about who the people really are on the other side it's so it's so damning to your side of this discussion that I pity you and and I laugh at you I do alright but look let's do the same thing what if I said the exact opposite of what I had said what if I said quote she's morally and intellectually bankrupt she's wrong and she's bad and she's stupid but she's so attractive that it's okay that would be the opposite all right that would be the opposite of my position but would that satisfy you no it wouldn't you'd probably regard that as sick and twisted and perverted and wrong so you are actually in a bad faith position here nothing I say about human beauty and attractiveness will satisfy you only if I remain completely silent will you be satisfied and that's not what I'm gonna do and it would be just as insincere and immoral if I went around pretending like oh I have a moral monopoly on discussions of First Nations people their politics if anything you say I'm gonna attack if I behave like hey I'm the moral authority on Cambodia nobody else can have an opinion about communism and the history of Cambodia and anything you say I'm gonna attack you your position here is any any statement about who's attractive and who's unattractive is inadmissible right and then it gets even more hypocritical because it's in reality it's anybody's opinion except yours right so human sexuality and attractiveness matter there are things I talk about in this channel all the time I give dating advice I talk about my real love life I talk about other people's of us have even done interviews via skype with other people we talk about their love lives so love and human sexuality always has been a part of this channel since year one if not day one and it's always gonna be a part of this channel and I provide real talk with I think honesty and integrity and I think I've brought a real contrast to what a lot of the scam artists are gonna tell you about beauty love matters of the heart and you know even indeed the the perception of beauty and health and certainly the quality and caliber of discussion on this channel of those issues is at a much much higher level than what you can get on Bani Rebecca's channel I believe today there are only 143 videos on her channel so you can just go and look at the list of titles it's not that hard to generalize I have over 1,000 videos on this channel so you might not even know you might not even know that I do videos talking about dating you know and romance and and beauty but those things are they are worth discussing that worth discussing seriously have a comment here from Lissa Smith Lissa Smith writes personally I think she's really pretty period so you have an opinion this is not a situation where you are criticizing me for daring to have an opinion on something where I ought not to have an opinion this situation where you have an opinion and I have an opinion and they're equally subjective and they're on the same level morally but you're still gonna go on to argue how dare you have an opinion right it's it's never gonna work if I'm here doing movie reviews doing music reviews if I was saying hey Bonnie Rebecca is a terrible film maker and a terrible musician and you say hey you know I liked your last film I liked her last music video that's just a difference of opinion right it's a it's a subjective judgment and of course part of what we're dealing with here is a moral and political judgment also but what I really want to talk about here we're gonna get into in this video or the long term knock-on effects for how these attitudes towards beauty lead to people being locked into leading a really meaningless life that has significance both in discussing bonny Rebecca and discussing my adversary vegan gains so Lissa writes in and I believe Lissa is 21 years old possibly she's 22 now last time she mentioned she was she was 21 and I believe bonny Rebecca is 26 personally I think she's really pretty I honestly do think that but also if she's an attractive then I'm butt-ass ugly wall okay so you know pause what if you watch youtube videos that make you feel stupid what if you watch YouTube videos that make you feel ignorant what did you watch YouTube videos from people who've really devoted years of their life what what if i watch youtube videos i wish this were true about Chinese politics after sit there and go wow this guy knows so much more Chinese fault I'm laughing because just yesterday I heard a podcast from a CIA intelligence guy who's supposed to be an expert on politics China it really did not feel a class effect so I wish I wish I had that humbling experience more often but there's there's not a lot of of informed opinion nor active research going on not that way but you know what if you were challenging yourself intellectually morally philosophically or even just in terms of life experience where there are people gone out and done things that you aspire to do that make you feel lazy you don't like here's someone with okay so you're saying if she's unattractive then I'm ugly okay so we had a real you with me Melissa's off-camera Melissa you were with me when I criticized a guy who was like University professor criticized his book about veganism his highly intellectual book about veganism and he just sent in he threw a tantrum on Facebook he was sending me all these you know angry masters I couldn't believe how how childish it was you know now I again that was kind of mind-blowing to me and I made a video in response to it and said okay look you know all he could do was basically say how dare you how dare you do a book review how dare you have a well-informed intellectual opinion of my book disagreeing with it that's mind blowing I wish this type of fragile attitude only concerned physical beauty it doesn't it absolutely involves intellectual and moral conceits as well and it's it's maybe even more tragic and more laughable when that happens so yeah I do book reviews most of them are negative you know hey showed up two through Citadis we have got got a book review of the cities the cities an author from from ancient Athens if you guys don't know the book review of Aristotle was mixed book view of Cicero you know whatever I you know some classical great philosophers got some positive but sure most of the book reviews in this channel are negative and I know it's really really hurt those authors but guess what if you're a bad book you can change you can write a new book starting tomorrow even now so Lissa you're 21 you can change you could open a new book starting tomorrow and your thing is about physical beauty you can't change most of us in all the ways that matter you can improve we were walking around Las Vegas Nevada and there's this really incongruous contrast between the beautiful people who are paid to stand there like a vaz who are paid to stand there like a statue just decorate the casino and the ugly people not necessarily old who were hunched over you know a card table or hunched over a computer terminal gambling smoking cigarettes drinking alcohol and most of them making no effort in terms of their physical appearance neither their style address nor otherwise you have the kind of ultra athletic ultra aesthetic you know woman serving the beer or sometimes just dancing on the table or remember some of them were just standing on the bar just standing still not even dancing not doing anything just standing there as a display of youth and health and beauty you know eight tenths naked a little bit more clothing than I than a bikini just staying there being ignored and then the crowds of the the unhealthy ugly people and you know most of those people if they quit smoking and quit drinking and quit gambling and started living a lifestyle more like the strippers who are in the same casino of course they could they could improve they could improve their appearance but you know most of them could never could never be that attractive it's not a choice it's not a choice you make right being stupid is a choice as a choice you're making today and tomorrow again and again and again the older you get that's why you stay stupid that's why you stay ignorant right being immoral is a choice and that's why so much about this course focuses on things those things that you can change but there are other elements to this right like the role of beauty here is dynamic I say later I'm gonna get to it I would never choose to watch a documentary or a news channel or to get my political news from this person rather than that person because this person is sexy to me this person is attractive and one of the most kind of crushing realizations when you walk around that casino in Las Vegas like maybe you see a you see a waitress or a stripper who's attractive to you you think is anyone stupid enough that they walk into this room and think oh wow I'm gonna go over there and gamble and I'm gonna go and order a beer so that I have a chance to talk to this track that woman for a few seconds you know whether that's a straight man or a lesbian woman but isn't that even more tragic is that sexuality is being exploited in this way to deceive and that there are some people out there maybe who want to be deceived that's even more tragic that to me is the next level that our society adds on to this but there's the lower underlying level that yeah we're all unequal and most of us are not comfortable with most of us are not dealing with a very well including you Lissa age 21 looking up to bonny Rebecca at age 26 I think there's a really important lesson for you to learn from this don't end up like bonny Rebecca don't end up a no-talent bum who's morally and intellectually bankrupt don't end up like vegan gains whether you're a guy or a girl you know make the decision to live a morally upright life with a real intellectual integrity and curiosity and challenge yourself to keep learning and keep growing you know and you know you may not have a choice about being ugly you have a choice about being an idiot you have a choice of a living life that's reckless and self-indulgent and self-destructive I want you to make the right choice you think bonny Rebecca is gonna make the right choice I think we know okay I continue I'm gonna skip over a couple of senses here because she just talks about the details of their their health problems when I say they I mean bonny Rebecca and her her boyfriend so I continue it just seems too good to be true they're claimed that a few bites of salmon really healed all of their gut and skin issues I don't know it's so wild to think about the fact that she was a panelist at VegFest that she partnered with so many vegan companies etc I even remember one vlog she was walking past eat up the meat aisle at the grocery store and put up a big middle finger in front of the camera so she you know showing her to stays for the mean industry I honestly came here to talk crap I need to stop haha but dude don't make fun of her appearance I'd kill to be half as attractive as her makes me feel ugly AF what does it say about you that that's what you react you in this video that that's the the moral of the story you you take from why are you watching Bonnie Rebecca and saying you'd kill to be half as attractive as her you know why don't you lead a life where you know you would be the envy of Bonnie Rebecca in those other categories like intellect talent morality leat leading a life that's really meaningful why don't you put her in the shade why don't you Eclipse her and leave her in your dust okay I wouldn't kill to look like anyone else I know you're half joking around here but I think it's really meaningful to reflect on just how dark that is just that what it said which is what that says about you and what your values really are and what is your smile and you in my video which was less than two minutes long and said nothing about her appearance and what you're not responding to in that video right so my reply was you say quote personally I think she's really pretty so your point seems to be that you're entitled to have a personal opinion and I'm not those what I said early on you have a subjective judgement but her appearance so do I um but there wasn't even all this stuff when we talk about it with men for some reason mysteriously it's it's not a big deal in the same way Logan Paul of course his appearance is a huge part of you Logan Paul has a shirt off all the time used to boxing match Logan Paul's face and his body has everything to do with his success does his sense of humor have Sonia of course he's a comedian of course a sense of humor also matters his ability to rap and make music nobody would claim that his vocal talent is more important than his appearance and that's okay and we can talk about that you know I think vegan gains we can talk about the importance of his physique and his appearance - right and your until death an opinion and so am i and it matters it's Celia it really does matter to this discussion under any of these having addicts why exactly does my personal tastes not matter when I claim she's not intelligent and not talented you think that isn't a matter of taste but only claims about beauty are subjective you have a lot of growing up to do homie if I say she's stupid and that makes you feel even stupider that gives you something to reflect on but it doesn't mean that I'm wrong in offering the critique you've got to examine why you only care about beauty not intellect or morality hint you're shallow I got a lot of feedback positive feedback honestly the the thumbs up two thumbs down ratio believe me was very favorable I got a lot of feedback when I criticized vegan gains now it's true in that video I don't think I mentioned his physical appearance cuz that's just not what we were talking about in that video but I could have I could have included some comments but the extent to which his fame and people taking his recommendations on bodybuilding really do relay to physical appearance in his case is an interesting contrast cuz there's his physical appearance and then there's how often he gets injured right I've said this on Twitter recently the real sport is his avoiding injury the rest is just weightlifting you know so I do think there's a sense in which people are probably misled by the fact that he's good-looking and are overlooking the extent to which he kind of like puts himself in the hospital every so often so he's giving you in my opinion I think he's giving me some vetted by somebody building and his appearance part of that we could talk about that but what I talked about my earlier video in vegan gains was that he was stupid and you know stupidity I've said this before it's like a fire in a wastepaper basket it's something fast-moving and always changing and destructive and dangerous okay I think a great example was actually vegan gains making several videos with rape allegations against durianrider right I'm not fond of durianrider I've been to court with during Ryder oh it was one of the people who stood up against during Ryder and said that he was peddling lies back when vegan gained support and back when vegan gains was reciprocally supported by durianrider right you guys know that when vegan gains made these videos that were frankly illegal I mean the type of defamation involved there is against the law I wrote two vegan gains directly and reminded him of the videos on my channel that absolutely calling the question and expose you know the factual basis the basic assumptions and claims of what he was doing and I think it was a series of three videos attacking during writer right stupidity is destructive what went into those videos for vegan gains a lot of self-righteousness a lot of anger you know this is how he lives his life as he puts it he does whatever he wants to do whenever he wants to do it I had people writing in to me in response to that video saying well I Zoll you're older than vegan gains maybe 14 years older I don't know I'm definitely more than a decade older than Richard and he said well you know maybe you're smarter and wiser than Richard now but you know he's gonna he's gonna catch up to you I wish I wish I could believe that I wish I could believe that about Richard and I wish I could believe that about Bani Rebecca okay we all know it's not true and this is why I mean you know this being you can look at an isolated example like what during writer did with the rape allegations recently deleted because he didn't want to have this channel deleted in fear yet retract these things you can look at what happened with bonny Rebecca and her giving up veganism stupidity is a choice your mental and intellectual characteristics are fast changing and it's not something that you only get the opportunity to shape once in your puberty that's the good news the good news is if you chose to major in chemistry you're not stuck with it you can still do philosophy or politics or learn Chinese or take on a new direction okay the fact that I speak Chinese now doesn't mean I gotta study Chinese rest of my life I can become a children's storybook writer I can you know start doing puppet shows for children the fact that I've done one career doesn't preclude me from doing another I can lead no I can learn new things I can take on new directions but all of it requires ambition and open-mindedness and taking on new challenges all of it requires a kind of I guess steadfastness to not do whatever it is you feel like doing to not live a life of mindless short-term self-indulgence which is exactly the life that's celebrated by both bonnie rebecca and vegan gains and that's the sense in which i felt they were both bad for the vegan movement and I'm not exactly sad to see them go