Beginnings and Endings: Durianrider, Freelee, NorVegan's "Unmasking" & Me.
28 June 2017 [link youtube]
Check out my earlier, more interesting video, "The wonder that was Freelee", here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJd6wQlMW5Y
Novegan's two hour long documentary is titled, "THE UNMASKING, part 3: The Projections": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5n_e8he_rk
Youtube Automatic Transcription
this guy has lied to an audience over
and over and over art for art's sake is like Jen for Jin's sake vodka for vodkas sake etc I've recently addressed the fact that part of my role here on YouTube is criticism and I'm not ashamed of that I don't apologize for that I think that in the same way that we have to recognize the role the critic in art the role of the critic and cinema is important the role of the critic in politics can be much more important and this whole controversy with durianrider and freely in the righto for diet it came into my life in a very peculiar way and I'd like to think that chapter of my life is now ending and we're moving on to other forms of critique other forms of engagement with what's going on in veganism ecology animal rights and related politics maybe even unrelated politics maybe we can get back to talking about the politics of Canada politics of Donald Trump politics of Asia who knows when we get back to some of those topics in my channel which if you go through the past videos we have more than 500 videos here I have actually touched on all that stuff at some point there's a lot more to this channel than Jerian writer and in fact it's a lot more this challenges veganism too with all Emmet said look there's a new two hour long documentary I'm going to hit you with a six minute clip of it right now you can click on the link below of this video to see it over on Noor vegans channel if you like these six minutes and you think it's telling you something here obviously you haven't already heard before for those of you who fold the story really closely one year ago down to including the present day it's not going to tell you a lot that you haven't heard before but it does put together in one two hours cinematic experience all this messy nonsense from this controversy that went from threats of a fistfight in the street to drama in the courtroom in Thailand Kaneko I had lied to in the audience over and over and over he's refused to give any legit certification of his criminal history claiming that I needed to provide legal proof that I was not a wife-beater although amusingly by complete coincidence I actually did provide him with a current criminal record check from Canada that relate to the job I had lined up in China I needed criminal background check to get that job so I did actually have a fresh criminal record check it's a lot more than the story no there's not a lot more to the story why is AI cumin why can't you put your effort into helping an animals versus putting vegan against vegan or praying or drama lives etc what can you do that why not make something bigger than just bashing during on a friendly why be so jealous or full of hate maybe you Irish you may be getting paid by meeting dairy a lot of you asked me to do a thing I did comment on it comment about it on Facebook during writer parley and his accusations and a lot of people calling this drama and and I get it to some degree but I don't it's not this isn't like someone broke up with someone let's gossip about it like this is actually something really serious and something that I think has serious implications and brings up some serious questions and ethical issues so after apologising he went straight back to doing the exact same thing he was apologizing for I do feel like the one comment where you had called aizawa's art a pedophile I do feel like if you hadn't made that statement this whole summer could have looked a lot different I really do believe that it was dude that gave us a lot of publicity and eventually expose what a fraud this [ __ ] is what a sleazebag what a sexual predator is do you really genuinely believe that how did the say in my opinion it's just like woman's manipulating Fox I had so many fights I've been in prison before it's no big deal to me if you try to use prison as a hey I went to prison I was like is he using that I'm kind of like to his followers to the Disney writers they like yeah our leaders been in prison Oh where's your leader beam going to prison doesn't mean you're tough spending time in prison doesn't make you tough I heard something interesting Joey Katherine who used to be hardest friend revealed a little something about these prison stories [Music] it's funny they say those two he's not scared of going back to prison I think he did one day in juvie for um for doing a graffiti taggers that me did one day and juvie it's pretty funny let's get him come back to prison ha ha ha oh I've been to jail I'm not scared of going back why say that dude you've never done jail you're a known rat and it's you're an actual if informant for the police you don't you're not a prison just just be here you are men be who you are I just are not convinced there's a sexual predator and that he was trying to [ __ ] Julian Bohr I'm not convinced of that but I mean is that what you're saying is that really what you're telling us that's that's my hunch that's my hunch I would rock being a tick being the teacher having an event attracts a lot of young women I would rather earn the side of caution then something to happen to so Hey look during all you had that happened I'll do what I have to do to protect and sing this whole controversy is like an IQ test for the Beatles watching it whatever one should pick up on is the miscellaneous nature of these accusations if the problem was that I was a pedophile and I say back to zero matter okay let's meet at the police station because he originally said he had criminal charges against me but he wanted me to be arrested and I said okay meet you at the police station why did he back down from that he backed down for it because it was a lie there never was a legitimate reason to think I was trying to get with teenage girls there never was a legitimate reason to think I was a pedophile and there also has never been a legitimate reason to think I was a wife-beater durianrider has defamed me threatened me and invited others to assault me originally he was saying he wanted other people to beat me up so they could abduct me and take me to the police station when I respond to that by offering to meet him at the police station is it look if you've actually are criminal charges to me let's go to the police station and let's see the evidence and let's go to court fine arrest me I'm not avoiding arrest and of course he suddenly lost interest in going to police what have you and you know he dropped the pretense of wanting to beat me up in order to take me to the police to face justice or to be arrested any then instead switch to just saying he wants to beat me up Zig beat me up I would [ __ ] him down Eliza man I would [ __ ] hunt him down for a friendly mood tie straight flat match I would [ __ ] hunt him down this is what it comes to threatening to beat someone up threatening to kill someone defaming someone as a sex predator you know it's so low and again it's not really about me or my feelings my ego this is so shameful for veganism Basel desk I would [ __ ] faut Lorraine and I'm going to crack both your [ __ ] legs in health care the last reply I got from durianrider before I blocked him on Facebook which ended the discussion the last message I got from head was so sue me then and he follows it up with a curse word I don't want to take during right into court but I will who's been drawing the line and saying no here's the line here's what's over but I have been that's why they hate me so much well they told me prison let's write up every [ __ ] day and go and find him and she'll know you found who toss Fitness no doubt about it durianrider has been threatening me with violence legally speaking he's now guilty of defamation uttering threats are ye uttering coats amounts and inciting violence and all of those are real crimes so I continued to lie about the situation and pretended that he had only called iyslah creep in a Facebook comment you cannot go to prison to call someone a creepy [ __ ] on Facebook who contacts 16 year old girls randomly you think it's a remission for a Facebook comment in what magical Court can you prosecute someone for something I wrote in facebook when which magical Court is this at me countess I'm imprisoned for a Facebook comment you can no I have to admit I did not enjoy spending two hours of my life watching that documentary I got to be under two hours I thought I wish I had spent that time doing push-ups I wish I had spent doing something else but I'm an unusual situation because I had to follow that whole drama as it unfolded I was involved and I was in court and everything so I already knew most of what it was telling me and also I'm in a position where I have to kind of wince because I often know exactly what's being added today what's being excluded I don't mean that as an unfair criticism for the filmmaker but of course that's the position I'm in sometimes the truth of what happened is even crazier then you know what you see camera would suggest for instance he he goes into some detail the filmmaker and showing how Gary and Ryder kept denying that the court case was real and ongoing even though it was ridiculous to do so you know there's plenty of evidence around that the court case was real but he doesn't show you that durianrider kept doing that even after I had posted videotape of myself going to the courtroom in person and me standing in the hallway in front of the courtroom with with the legal documents during writer made statements of the internet claiming that I had hired actors to pretend to be my lawyers and to walk into the courtroom with me he was still claiming it was fake you know even at that point he was still claim it was fake even after we spoke face to face well sorry via via the internet sort of a vile camera chat what if you want to say red camera and sound and I was feeding him directly saying during writer you need to hire a lawyer the court case is real I told him to date on the next court date and all he had to do was go and check he could have had legal representation there he could have been defended so even in that kind of thing I mean the filmmaker is doing his best to give you a concise overview of what happened the reality is diretor I did writers behavior was even more unreasonable it's even more crazy that is you know being suggested by this this summary so look a lot of people have asked why did I go to Chiangmai in the first place I think they asked that because they think there's going to be some kind of interesting secret revealed by the answer and there really isn't I almost never get asked I think nobody's ever asked why did I decide to criticize your mother and Phil in the first place the answer that is I think a little bit more interesting and you know now I have to look back the amount of time and energy into debunking durianrider as opposed to other possibly more meaningful content on my channel uh if you go back I mean they're not well-made compared to my current videos I have one videos I think quite well made that's called the wonder that was freely looking back at me really an analytical way why did people become true believers in this why do people get interested why was the support for this you know very eccentric movement within being as long as it's so intense over a short period of time but you know I think for me the turning point was just that I didn't want to deal with diet on my channel at all and I went through the videos by two youtubers one of whom is now using the name the microbe or diet and the other whom the other whom is unnatural vegan I thought I was making one video and I thought I could just allude to the fact that durian riders diet advice had been debunked I guess throw in some short clips from these two other channels and then move on but I wouldn't have to discuss that but what I was going through their videos I found they really didn't do that they really did not say what needed to be said and it was kind of in my case it was just a vague member I thought unnatural begin to dealt with that really thoroughly but then when I went back I was just looking for clips to find exactly what she said and put it together it wasn't there so you know it kind of fell on me to say okay I've got to put together a concise summary that really answers the claims these people are making and it outlines what the problem is with their diet advice so that was a turning point both for my channel and for them because the sort of topic I wouldn't want to talk about but it was something nobody else was talking about so for example vegan gains would have been natural for that but at the time vegan gains was a kind of a lie of durianrider and freelee's he didn't criticize their health and diet advice or anything else they did I remember being at the time he just said that his channel wasn't set up to criticise other vegans you know he only wanted to criticise meat eaters and meat based diets so we didn't want to criticize you know misleading claims made by righto for a particularly eccentric vegan diet so that as I say kind of ended up on my shoulders the first direct response I had from durianrider the first time he made a video us to my channel was not answering the health and diet advice I gave but it was about Crohn's disease so cause disease is a very very serious illness I mean durianrider whether or not he ever had close disease whether or not there was any substance to his claim to having cured crohn's disease he made a bunch of questionable claims that it seemed nobody else's questioning against since then I have asked vegan gains directly I said why didn't you ever deal with this and he just said he didn't even know about it he'd never heard of him he wasn't aware that during Ryder made these kinds of you know pseudo scientific genuinely misleading and immoral claims he's claiming to have cured an incurable disease and as I did more reading about that and had people writing in tune with advice I found that really if you just pay attention what during writer said closely if you just looked at the inconsistencies in his claims it really seems like he never had the disease in the first place but during writer you know responds out the video the original title was something like I ten thousand percent cured Crohn's disease something like this I don't know if you later change that to a hundred percent he actually misspelled Crohn's disease in the title and went back and made some changes but he he made a video absolutely doubling down in his claim and from that point I knew I already knew that they were watching the videos on my channel both freelee and durianrider and they were responding to them both directly and indirectly so at that point he had one video directly addressed to my channel dealing with you know the questions I'd raised about Crohn's disease and thus also more broadly about the legitimacy of his his diet and health and exercise advice topics I never thought about what shell would really deal with it's just not my forte at some of my channel supposed to be about and a lot of those videos on my channel got significant numbers of viewers more than thirty thousand viewers so that's that really is how one thing led to another with me and dairy minor when I arrived in Chiang Mai I met up with a girl named Lea first named Lea she's appeared on this channel Lea had just seen freely and Harley at the grocery store is go to the same grocery store she'd bumped into them there in shame I and Frehley was furious absolutely furious course Darian Reiner was his usual self you know she was just furious at lea because leah had dared to question the diet so for those people in terms of their view of the world there was no legitimate role for criticism you know there was no legitimate for questioning their whole mentality and the way they ran their the way they ran their club let's put it that way was that either you were for them or against them either you were a supporter or you were the enemy and the truth is they didn't treat their supporters very well and they didn't treat their enemies very well either they didn't even treat their own supporters with dignity and they treated their enemies horribly I'll tell you something else though I have not received one email of apology not one from anybody admitting that they were wrong and that they took the wrong side or did the wrong thing all of us within veganism we think of veganism as this morally positive cause and therefore we like to imagine all the people within veganism as being morally and intellectually virtuous and they're not I mean you can just look at the numbers involved my audience is small I'm totally happy with that the type of content I create is only appealing to an interesting to a small audience really focused on vegan activism organization political dissent you know future of the planet ecology ethics etc I know they're only a few thousand people interested in that type of content the Internet I'm totally happy with the size of audiences of God but then you look at the tens of thousands the tens of thousands who were so eager to jump on durian writers bandwagon so eager to jump on vegan cheetahs bandwagon and now those wagons have stopped rolling and where are those apologies guys you know there should be one I should have one email that I can show here I should have can should have ten emails for those tens of thousands of people because it's more than ten thousand people and it's more than ten thousand vegans it's more than ten thousand of us who were dead wrong on this it's go and they weren't quiet either they weren't no see they were just silently sitting back and judging me these were people who really want another way to condemn me as a liar and a fraud and all these terrible things when I was telling the truth at every stage and I'm still telling the truth now but you know I've made this comparison before if you look at some of the YouTube channels that are devoted to comic books mainstream a DC Comics Marvel Comics superhero comics they really do have more of a community than veganism does in 2017 really I'm not being sarcastic I'm not take a look they have conferences their meetings they buy airplane tickets they do fundraisers they have donations they auctioneers the money to have a convention and then people fly there I think you can look at the game of Thrones fan community but yeah sure the comic books are a really good example they have more elements of a real community than vegans ever have had and safety ever will and you can look through the comments below their channels go through their controversy sometimes those guys do have their own scandals but not like this and I don't see this level of you know mean-spirited vitriolic you know ultimately just malicious infighting within those other digital Demi moms you know and I think it really is worthwhile to look across the table look at what the guys in comic books are going on and ask yourself why can't we have that if and where it's going to start wearing more of a more of a constructive attitude towards making the most out of what we got here in veganism in terms of human resources can it start with this can it start with you watching this video right now can it start with something you can do today or tomorrow or sitting down with your calendar and looking ahead to the rest of this year I don't know what the future big ism is but the future of veganism is not durianrider it's not vegan cheetah it's not a community built on slander and defamation and get skinny quick $35 ebooks it's just not
and over and over art for art's sake is like Jen for Jin's sake vodka for vodkas sake etc I've recently addressed the fact that part of my role here on YouTube is criticism and I'm not ashamed of that I don't apologize for that I think that in the same way that we have to recognize the role the critic in art the role of the critic and cinema is important the role of the critic in politics can be much more important and this whole controversy with durianrider and freely in the righto for diet it came into my life in a very peculiar way and I'd like to think that chapter of my life is now ending and we're moving on to other forms of critique other forms of engagement with what's going on in veganism ecology animal rights and related politics maybe even unrelated politics maybe we can get back to talking about the politics of Canada politics of Donald Trump politics of Asia who knows when we get back to some of those topics in my channel which if you go through the past videos we have more than 500 videos here I have actually touched on all that stuff at some point there's a lot more to this channel than Jerian writer and in fact it's a lot more this challenges veganism too with all Emmet said look there's a new two hour long documentary I'm going to hit you with a six minute clip of it right now you can click on the link below of this video to see it over on Noor vegans channel if you like these six minutes and you think it's telling you something here obviously you haven't already heard before for those of you who fold the story really closely one year ago down to including the present day it's not going to tell you a lot that you haven't heard before but it does put together in one two hours cinematic experience all this messy nonsense from this controversy that went from threats of a fistfight in the street to drama in the courtroom in Thailand Kaneko I had lied to in the audience over and over and over he's refused to give any legit certification of his criminal history claiming that I needed to provide legal proof that I was not a wife-beater although amusingly by complete coincidence I actually did provide him with a current criminal record check from Canada that relate to the job I had lined up in China I needed criminal background check to get that job so I did actually have a fresh criminal record check it's a lot more than the story no there's not a lot more to the story why is AI cumin why can't you put your effort into helping an animals versus putting vegan against vegan or praying or drama lives etc what can you do that why not make something bigger than just bashing during on a friendly why be so jealous or full of hate maybe you Irish you may be getting paid by meeting dairy a lot of you asked me to do a thing I did comment on it comment about it on Facebook during writer parley and his accusations and a lot of people calling this drama and and I get it to some degree but I don't it's not this isn't like someone broke up with someone let's gossip about it like this is actually something really serious and something that I think has serious implications and brings up some serious questions and ethical issues so after apologising he went straight back to doing the exact same thing he was apologizing for I do feel like the one comment where you had called aizawa's art a pedophile I do feel like if you hadn't made that statement this whole summer could have looked a lot different I really do believe that it was dude that gave us a lot of publicity and eventually expose what a fraud this [ __ ] is what a sleazebag what a sexual predator is do you really genuinely believe that how did the say in my opinion it's just like woman's manipulating Fox I had so many fights I've been in prison before it's no big deal to me if you try to use prison as a hey I went to prison I was like is he using that I'm kind of like to his followers to the Disney writers they like yeah our leaders been in prison Oh where's your leader beam going to prison doesn't mean you're tough spending time in prison doesn't make you tough I heard something interesting Joey Katherine who used to be hardest friend revealed a little something about these prison stories [Music] it's funny they say those two he's not scared of going back to prison I think he did one day in juvie for um for doing a graffiti taggers that me did one day and juvie it's pretty funny let's get him come back to prison ha ha ha oh I've been to jail I'm not scared of going back why say that dude you've never done jail you're a known rat and it's you're an actual if informant for the police you don't you're not a prison just just be here you are men be who you are I just are not convinced there's a sexual predator and that he was trying to [ __ ] Julian Bohr I'm not convinced of that but I mean is that what you're saying is that really what you're telling us that's that's my hunch that's my hunch I would rock being a tick being the teacher having an event attracts a lot of young women I would rather earn the side of caution then something to happen to so Hey look during all you had that happened I'll do what I have to do to protect and sing this whole controversy is like an IQ test for the Beatles watching it whatever one should pick up on is the miscellaneous nature of these accusations if the problem was that I was a pedophile and I say back to zero matter okay let's meet at the police station because he originally said he had criminal charges against me but he wanted me to be arrested and I said okay meet you at the police station why did he back down from that he backed down for it because it was a lie there never was a legitimate reason to think I was trying to get with teenage girls there never was a legitimate reason to think I was a pedophile and there also has never been a legitimate reason to think I was a wife-beater durianrider has defamed me threatened me and invited others to assault me originally he was saying he wanted other people to beat me up so they could abduct me and take me to the police station when I respond to that by offering to meet him at the police station is it look if you've actually are criminal charges to me let's go to the police station and let's see the evidence and let's go to court fine arrest me I'm not avoiding arrest and of course he suddenly lost interest in going to police what have you and you know he dropped the pretense of wanting to beat me up in order to take me to the police to face justice or to be arrested any then instead switch to just saying he wants to beat me up Zig beat me up I would [ __ ] him down Eliza man I would [ __ ] hunt him down for a friendly mood tie straight flat match I would [ __ ] hunt him down this is what it comes to threatening to beat someone up threatening to kill someone defaming someone as a sex predator you know it's so low and again it's not really about me or my feelings my ego this is so shameful for veganism Basel desk I would [ __ ] faut Lorraine and I'm going to crack both your [ __ ] legs in health care the last reply I got from durianrider before I blocked him on Facebook which ended the discussion the last message I got from head was so sue me then and he follows it up with a curse word I don't want to take during right into court but I will who's been drawing the line and saying no here's the line here's what's over but I have been that's why they hate me so much well they told me prison let's write up every [ __ ] day and go and find him and she'll know you found who toss Fitness no doubt about it durianrider has been threatening me with violence legally speaking he's now guilty of defamation uttering threats are ye uttering coats amounts and inciting violence and all of those are real crimes so I continued to lie about the situation and pretended that he had only called iyslah creep in a Facebook comment you cannot go to prison to call someone a creepy [ __ ] on Facebook who contacts 16 year old girls randomly you think it's a remission for a Facebook comment in what magical Court can you prosecute someone for something I wrote in facebook when which magical Court is this at me countess I'm imprisoned for a Facebook comment you can no I have to admit I did not enjoy spending two hours of my life watching that documentary I got to be under two hours I thought I wish I had spent that time doing push-ups I wish I had spent doing something else but I'm an unusual situation because I had to follow that whole drama as it unfolded I was involved and I was in court and everything so I already knew most of what it was telling me and also I'm in a position where I have to kind of wince because I often know exactly what's being added today what's being excluded I don't mean that as an unfair criticism for the filmmaker but of course that's the position I'm in sometimes the truth of what happened is even crazier then you know what you see camera would suggest for instance he he goes into some detail the filmmaker and showing how Gary and Ryder kept denying that the court case was real and ongoing even though it was ridiculous to do so you know there's plenty of evidence around that the court case was real but he doesn't show you that durianrider kept doing that even after I had posted videotape of myself going to the courtroom in person and me standing in the hallway in front of the courtroom with with the legal documents during writer made statements of the internet claiming that I had hired actors to pretend to be my lawyers and to walk into the courtroom with me he was still claiming it was fake you know even at that point he was still claim it was fake even after we spoke face to face well sorry via via the internet sort of a vile camera chat what if you want to say red camera and sound and I was feeding him directly saying during writer you need to hire a lawyer the court case is real I told him to date on the next court date and all he had to do was go and check he could have had legal representation there he could have been defended so even in that kind of thing I mean the filmmaker is doing his best to give you a concise overview of what happened the reality is diretor I did writers behavior was even more unreasonable it's even more crazy that is you know being suggested by this this summary so look a lot of people have asked why did I go to Chiangmai in the first place I think they asked that because they think there's going to be some kind of interesting secret revealed by the answer and there really isn't I almost never get asked I think nobody's ever asked why did I decide to criticize your mother and Phil in the first place the answer that is I think a little bit more interesting and you know now I have to look back the amount of time and energy into debunking durianrider as opposed to other possibly more meaningful content on my channel uh if you go back I mean they're not well-made compared to my current videos I have one videos I think quite well made that's called the wonder that was freely looking back at me really an analytical way why did people become true believers in this why do people get interested why was the support for this you know very eccentric movement within being as long as it's so intense over a short period of time but you know I think for me the turning point was just that I didn't want to deal with diet on my channel at all and I went through the videos by two youtubers one of whom is now using the name the microbe or diet and the other whom the other whom is unnatural vegan I thought I was making one video and I thought I could just allude to the fact that durian riders diet advice had been debunked I guess throw in some short clips from these two other channels and then move on but I wouldn't have to discuss that but what I was going through their videos I found they really didn't do that they really did not say what needed to be said and it was kind of in my case it was just a vague member I thought unnatural begin to dealt with that really thoroughly but then when I went back I was just looking for clips to find exactly what she said and put it together it wasn't there so you know it kind of fell on me to say okay I've got to put together a concise summary that really answers the claims these people are making and it outlines what the problem is with their diet advice so that was a turning point both for my channel and for them because the sort of topic I wouldn't want to talk about but it was something nobody else was talking about so for example vegan gains would have been natural for that but at the time vegan gains was a kind of a lie of durianrider and freelee's he didn't criticize their health and diet advice or anything else they did I remember being at the time he just said that his channel wasn't set up to criticise other vegans you know he only wanted to criticise meat eaters and meat based diets so we didn't want to criticize you know misleading claims made by righto for a particularly eccentric vegan diet so that as I say kind of ended up on my shoulders the first direct response I had from durianrider the first time he made a video us to my channel was not answering the health and diet advice I gave but it was about Crohn's disease so cause disease is a very very serious illness I mean durianrider whether or not he ever had close disease whether or not there was any substance to his claim to having cured crohn's disease he made a bunch of questionable claims that it seemed nobody else's questioning against since then I have asked vegan gains directly I said why didn't you ever deal with this and he just said he didn't even know about it he'd never heard of him he wasn't aware that during Ryder made these kinds of you know pseudo scientific genuinely misleading and immoral claims he's claiming to have cured an incurable disease and as I did more reading about that and had people writing in tune with advice I found that really if you just pay attention what during writer said closely if you just looked at the inconsistencies in his claims it really seems like he never had the disease in the first place but during writer you know responds out the video the original title was something like I ten thousand percent cured Crohn's disease something like this I don't know if you later change that to a hundred percent he actually misspelled Crohn's disease in the title and went back and made some changes but he he made a video absolutely doubling down in his claim and from that point I knew I already knew that they were watching the videos on my channel both freelee and durianrider and they were responding to them both directly and indirectly so at that point he had one video directly addressed to my channel dealing with you know the questions I'd raised about Crohn's disease and thus also more broadly about the legitimacy of his his diet and health and exercise advice topics I never thought about what shell would really deal with it's just not my forte at some of my channel supposed to be about and a lot of those videos on my channel got significant numbers of viewers more than thirty thousand viewers so that's that really is how one thing led to another with me and dairy minor when I arrived in Chiang Mai I met up with a girl named Lea first named Lea she's appeared on this channel Lea had just seen freely and Harley at the grocery store is go to the same grocery store she'd bumped into them there in shame I and Frehley was furious absolutely furious course Darian Reiner was his usual self you know she was just furious at lea because leah had dared to question the diet so for those people in terms of their view of the world there was no legitimate role for criticism you know there was no legitimate for questioning their whole mentality and the way they ran their the way they ran their club let's put it that way was that either you were for them or against them either you were a supporter or you were the enemy and the truth is they didn't treat their supporters very well and they didn't treat their enemies very well either they didn't even treat their own supporters with dignity and they treated their enemies horribly I'll tell you something else though I have not received one email of apology not one from anybody admitting that they were wrong and that they took the wrong side or did the wrong thing all of us within veganism we think of veganism as this morally positive cause and therefore we like to imagine all the people within veganism as being morally and intellectually virtuous and they're not I mean you can just look at the numbers involved my audience is small I'm totally happy with that the type of content I create is only appealing to an interesting to a small audience really focused on vegan activism organization political dissent you know future of the planet ecology ethics etc I know they're only a few thousand people interested in that type of content the Internet I'm totally happy with the size of audiences of God but then you look at the tens of thousands the tens of thousands who were so eager to jump on durian writers bandwagon so eager to jump on vegan cheetahs bandwagon and now those wagons have stopped rolling and where are those apologies guys you know there should be one I should have one email that I can show here I should have can should have ten emails for those tens of thousands of people because it's more than ten thousand people and it's more than ten thousand vegans it's more than ten thousand of us who were dead wrong on this it's go and they weren't quiet either they weren't no see they were just silently sitting back and judging me these were people who really want another way to condemn me as a liar and a fraud and all these terrible things when I was telling the truth at every stage and I'm still telling the truth now but you know I've made this comparison before if you look at some of the YouTube channels that are devoted to comic books mainstream a DC Comics Marvel Comics superhero comics they really do have more of a community than veganism does in 2017 really I'm not being sarcastic I'm not take a look they have conferences their meetings they buy airplane tickets they do fundraisers they have donations they auctioneers the money to have a convention and then people fly there I think you can look at the game of Thrones fan community but yeah sure the comic books are a really good example they have more elements of a real community than vegans ever have had and safety ever will and you can look through the comments below their channels go through their controversy sometimes those guys do have their own scandals but not like this and I don't see this level of you know mean-spirited vitriolic you know ultimately just malicious infighting within those other digital Demi moms you know and I think it really is worthwhile to look across the table look at what the guys in comic books are going on and ask yourself why can't we have that if and where it's going to start wearing more of a more of a constructive attitude towards making the most out of what we got here in veganism in terms of human resources can it start with this can it start with you watching this video right now can it start with something you can do today or tomorrow or sitting down with your calendar and looking ahead to the rest of this year I don't know what the future big ism is but the future of veganism is not durianrider it's not vegan cheetah it's not a community built on slander and defamation and get skinny quick $35 ebooks it's just not