The Vegan Demimonde: Mexie, Ask Yourself & Anti-Communism.
11 December 2017 [link youtube]
A conversation about the digital vegan demimonde and, in large part, about Communism and Anti-Communism.
BTW, criticism of Mexie does, in fact, get its own playlist on this channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/HeiJinZhengZhi/playlists
Youtube Automatic Transcription
so I appreciated that you've just
recorded that video because I saw some similarities or some parallels with ask yourself so ask yourself made excuses for Cory McCarthy and in this same way Mexi is associating herself with Finnish Bolshevik this guy who is clearly in favor of radical regimes current violent terrorist groups current violent like you don't where they don't even average they're out in the jungle with yeah right right so I appreciate that you take this the stance and even though I think most people are giving her a pass on that because it's because it's left-wing rather than right-wing I think it is true that in this society that we live in people are very reactionary toward right-wing ideology is a not left-wing well you you all just ask the question you started to ask me a second ago you're like you know well in effect would you be in a vegan group you know or in a vegan roundtable that included ask yourself would you be in one that included maxi so it's a really interesting comparison and it's a really interesting question right like of the two of them obviously ask yourself is way rougher around the edges like Mexi really puts a respectable face on this stuff she looks harmless she does her hair and makeup and she speaks in this you know calm and reassuring way it's hard to believe she's threatened everyone and you know with ask yourself you get you know we get a lot of Sturm and wrong sorry it sort of laps it it's Jo but you know you get a lot of the agony but I think I think the truth is just like I think he still is asking himself questions you know look I think he is capable of change but I think he's capable of reconsidering you know his deep-seated assumptions and opinions even about racism which is all stuff I've really confronted about really debated with him and I've had some kind of impact on the guy it's obvious you know it did matter to him you know my opinions and I raised issues and concerns and questions he never thought about before so it's funny of the two of them I don't think I'm hurt without their fun you know I that's easier to say though that's easy to say you know in the future it's easy for me to imagine yourself really making progress maybe precisely because he is so rough around the edges whereas I see someone like Maxie just being you know very comfortable in her position of you know how am I gonna say it you know she's having her cake and eating it too I mean when it's convenient for her to present herself as just a moderate leftist she does and when it's convenient for her to present herself as a hardline communist in favor of you know People's War class war Maoist revolutionary methods and even current you know guerrilla fighters would have you she she can do that to my life communism has not come up in my life really until I moved to show that yeah so this is probably you know just ignorant question you know like she calls people comrade and really does call people comrade it's true that is you've noticed why are you been living in China has anyone called you comrade I don't think so no but in the next light footage that we watched it was translating it into like so when when the actor uh sorry famous silent film actor Charlie Chaplin when he was put on trial in effect for being communist he was at least questioned by the authority he didn't quite get to trial what is the question they actually went through the records of him and took out every time he used the word calm yeah anybody Quito they asked him to walk it no no just in in public lectures in real life and political coordination so in this contra fir to this guy is comrade that's kind of yeah yeah because it is so before communism it was just a normal word of the English language it was just come we still have worked like camaraderie and so on but no it has become a distinctive sign of communism yeah right yeah anyway did you ever question to that what no yeah I was just like you know that is identifying yourself with this you know I don't know if there's a parallel term and waiter don't write like you know you know it just it does identify yourself as being a part of this ideology that even if you say you're not you don't you know identify yourself with it right well you know when she does yeah III assume she's being sincere when obviously she says she has misgivings about totalitarian bureaucratic rihanna's on mmm so do i but I'm not a communist I'm also not making excuses for them and so on you know I really do wish these people the best I mean it's possible she could ask yourself these questions and do some research and a merger to the other end of this rabbit hole but again you know so the other channel finished bullsh Bolshevik if you're looking at that in context it's totally reasonable for me to ask these questions and this is a very clear red flag and yes she does refer to finish Bolshevik as comrade and everyone else that's not guilt by association but that really is the context within which you refer to herself as a communist and a Marxist Leninist taking more salonist approaches like Donald Trump is taken crap recently because he retweeted videos from somebody in the UK who's a fascist yeah so in the same way if you're like if you were collaborating or associating yourself with other groups other people that are you know proclaiming one ideology or I think though I mean you know in terms of the asymmetry between the right and the left on this most people are just willing to concede without investigating at all that somehow there's a kernel of the original pure communist philosophy that's good and well intentioned and that it's it's me that it's merely you know covered with the dirt of history like like at the bar there was a diamond and they started rolling it down a muddy slope and then by the end the diamond was covered with mud but there's still a diamond in there that's that people are willing to concede that with not even Wikipedia level reading right yeah you little design what no no I was just gonna say like recently I have heard that like like I said you know yeah like it communism hasn't been something that I'm knowledgeable about but like a couple of my friends I was just recently like like in touch with them and yeah sorry sorry dude it's really just one that like she seems to have communist beliefs and we're just like where is this coming from I think it's maybe it really is like Facebook yeah most people choose some religion ideological Facebook these days she gets it from tumblr I think yeah you know oh yeah right okay tumblr rather than Facebook sorry my mom or willing to say things on tumblr than they are on Facebook because of anonymity I guess yeah well I was gonna say I really feel the other way about it but I'm someone who really has read and studied Commerce philosophy like it's not the core it's the mud and the outside I can see some value in I was just saying you a minute ago like so we're living right now in China the reality of what China is today I can totally understand someone respecting it so let's say you're from Angola in Africa today you're in Angola and you look at China and you think okay we can learn something for this guy not from communist philosophy not from the Cultural Revolution the Great Leap Forward not from Mao Zedong not from the violent not from the period before 1949 not from the horrible violence in the decades after no but you can learn from what China is today as a totally corrupt totally capitalist country with a communist dictatorship you know on top on the top of the pyramid right that I understand that would be one of the things to the bottom of the hill you say wow the mud on the outside this is pretty good you know that makes sense to me that I could respect and that would be a moderate position even though I think anymore you spent time in China thinks wow this this country's got a lot right you've done a lot right why can't you guys have freedom of the press free speech elections why can't you meet the minimum standards other countries meet why can't you replace that agitator ship on the top with something else you know I you know would but it's really a totally false object because in my opinion the philosophy of the core of it it really is poison that's why it's so jarring to communist I even remember Slava Dziedzic talking about this so a name of the moment but you know a lot of Communists they feel that Stalin was evil but then the earlier period with Lenin was morally good so this is one of many things and then when I say to them I've mentioned this recently on my channel I said well you said well do you know that they actually had elections in 1917 and you know what happened after right right and lennie the side no oh that's that's another whole story hunting down a murder me Trotsky yeah that goes on and on no no no it wasn't Trotsky ran against him in two elections the party that won the elections was called the socialist revolutionary party who are a far left-wing party and then the Bolsheviks hunted down and murdered everyone elected to Parliament their fellow left wingers the socialist because they were much more threatened by people who were their competition on the far left then they were by people who were right-wing or centrist or Democrats or so those were the people that really wanted to murder where they kept the competition but Lenin lost the elections he didn't win and then he canceled the elections they actually Parliament met once they had one day of meeting and then he started hunting down and killing everyone in Parliament and on a village by village basis he wrote about this in 1920 they started killing every one of the villages who supported any of the other parties which was of course the vast majority of the population because in most of these areas like less than 5% of people voted for the Bolsheviks and they knew that because they had the poll results so they were persecuting and murdering the other 95% it's it's really that extreme anyway but what was when you see that someone who has that view where they feel there's this diamond in the mud right and they were thinking that Lenin was pure and then later Stalin was impure then they're like it's not always but one response that sometimes you just get shock and disbelief you get people who don't want to accept that but then they just try to go back to the earlier period what's like oh well the period with with Marx and angles like the period before line end you know that was good and then you start breaking down whoa you know do you know what they actually said about the french revolution revolution good well it's simply what they praise cuz again like I can't say there's nothing good about the French Revolution but when Marx and Engels liked it but the French Revolution was was the great terror as it's known to everyone else was the persecution and massacre of people the cutting off the heads of aristocrats being right about it very clearly they wanted that to go further that's their model of social change they don't they don't find the best part of the French Revolution the best part of the French Revolution is basically just people sitting down and writing a new constitution a new Declaration of Rights and saying that slavery is bad like yes slavery is bad unfortunately the French Revolution concludes with Napoleon taking over and legalizing slavery again you know there are there are some things you can really respect especially the early days of revolution but what Marx and angles are responding to what they're enthusiastic about is the worst element of the French Revolution and that really played out in history played in the history of Russia but in history of Europe and also played out in the history of China here where they imitated those principles where we really had mass murder you know in in in imitation yeah once you're saying in Cambodia people were saying that same excuse like well if we would have kept murdering people yes it would have kept doing what Yeah right it comes ultimately the mentality comes straight out of Marx and angles because they're feeling what the French Revolution was in this late period the great terror period that if only it had gone further if only it had it had kept going and it didn't have this this reactionary tendency that people wanted to stop massacring people that that that it would have succeeded and that's right then even when you look at Cambodia you know in the 1970s and pathetically the attitude well sorry doesn't even end 1970s and 80s and 90s because the Khmer Rouge they cease to control the capital but they keep murdering people it's really really a sad history right up until they're there their reign of terror ends when um Bill Clinton is in power amazingly um anyway but you know and their attitude sincerely is if only they had kept killing more people then like utopia was just around the corner you know just a few more years of mass starvation and mass murder and utopia is just over though but look at ask another question um at what point does a word get discredit just the word come talk about thanks doc you know the history time onething but like at what point would you stop using that label because it's killed too many people like even even if you believe those even if you sincerely believe those are misinterpretations and what would you see you know what this is a little bit too susceptible to misinterpretation when do you when do you hit that point because like for real you know I am I am anti-catholic I am the world's harshest [ __ ] critic of the Catholic Church for exactly the same reason like at what point you say the Catholic Church is discredit zone it's killing millions of people look at what it did to the native people in Canada and I'm Canadians that matters to me especially but look what Catholic Church did all around the world look what it did in small Polynesian islands you know look what it did within Italy look what it I Roland Ireland has really [ __ ] up by Catholicism too I mean that that's a different kind of remote island you know I mean completely [ __ ] the Catholics destroyed Ireland what can I tell you you know there's a great documentary by the way okay it's not that great is it okay documentary called sex and a cold climate and it's just oh my god so depressing and you know it includes sexual it includes specific sexual misconduct by the Catholic Church but also just raises the general question of how like all of Ireland is like mentally and psychologically crippled but the sexual politics of Catholicism you know what I mean anyway you know at what point at what point do you just decide you know the word you know the term National Socialist most off the previous the Nazi it's kind of been discredited guys like still the term communist I mean at this point I'm sorry I just I just don't get it and I struggled I wish you know in Canada was really a problem the Green Party is [ __ ] up well what are you gonna do is start the maroon party like it so it's a real problem you can run out of words sometimes it's a real creative challenge I don't want the term veganism that's one of the reasons I came on YouTube in the first place criticizing people I don't want people like Gary Yourofsky to discredit the word veganism I don't want durianrider to describe the review I don't want to have to get a new word I'm defending that label but I'll tell you something at some point I mean if the word veganism is associated with the kind of atrocities communism is listed with I'll get rid of the term I'm gonna come up with a new label no the same way I like if people that you know if a lot of people who are vegan are communist then yeah yeah blackening the name annoy it's true I I don't remember any other YouTube channel talking about that before I came on but like really saying look guys veganism is not left-wing and I got I got a ton of feedback you know positive and negative and just a dude with like oh gee you know that never the you know veganism is also not yoga you know what I mean like I'm just saying veganism has to be separated from some of the accretions some of the cultural associations that have been that have been attached to it but yeah they so with it in the case of veganism it's the exact opposite I do think it's the diamond I don't think it's the other stuff the core idea is what I really think is positive and good and but know if it gets associated with far left-wing politics and that was that was the whole argument if the intersectional people that was what they wanted they actively wanted to Sassoon subsume pardon me subsumed veganism within left-wing politics it's like no to me this is fundamentally you know I don't even want I don't even want veganism to be subsumed within the the you know animal rescue paradigm or the me know like even that even some closely related things and animal rights I have to say no this is not the same and it's not the same as taking care of stray paths or whatever you know we really need to separate and say veganism is just so you know yeah but look on the other hand I've said before to you this is a challenge for me I think it's a challenge gonna have all my life if you really believe that veganism is for everybody then that also means it's for people you disagree with so that means you're you know it's also for Mexi and it's also for these these right-wing people and and what have you and that's that's a struggle run out of all our lives right right you remember the video I did making fun of the Holocaust the Holocaust and iron guy the vegan Holocaust and I remember him yeah I think he's in Shanghai that guy I know last I heard he was a chiang mai hopefully we might bump into him at Jame I hope not but yeah um you know in that case my response to him I just you know I don't take him seriously at all you know it's it to me that's it's a laughing matter you know put it that way you can see I spotted to it seriously I was harshly condemning what he said but you know to me I don't think that obviously that guy just glanced around the internet so but I mean you know just keep it by him with somebody like Maxie I'm not doing them to the service of thinking they don't know what they're talking about I'm taking it seriously to that extent if this person says in the internet that this is their political position and you know yeah III really believe in freedom of speech she has the right to come on the internet and make her pitch to play some kind of leadership role in the vegan movement and she's doing a better job than durianrider she's like really that's the real comparison that's the alternative people that people look at her people look at privileged vegan and then people look at people like you know they look at durianrider and they look at someone like a natural vegan I mean a natural vegan is not providing any leadership for the vegan moment she could but you know I miss very strange things I said she's not looking for community she's not looking for anyone yeah I don't you know deal is she just makes money out of YouTube apparently I mean she's not she's done the Reston activism period I think she's not interested in organizing anything so okay fine that's you know but I mean you know someone like Maxie I really respect her right to step up and try to play a leadership role I really do I don't even know what her PhD in is in but she's apparently getting a PhD and so on so she you know she may be in a position that I can only say the same thing I'd say but ask yourself who share this conversation you know who's flirted with far right-wing stuff who's flirted with racist stuff and so um but he doesn't really know what he's doing you know I hope you do the math I hope you do the reading I hope you think this all the way through I hope you keep questioning your assumptions and I hope that at the end of that process you're a better person that you are today because who you are today and what you worked des is a sack of [ __ ]
recorded that video because I saw some similarities or some parallels with ask yourself so ask yourself made excuses for Cory McCarthy and in this same way Mexi is associating herself with Finnish Bolshevik this guy who is clearly in favor of radical regimes current violent terrorist groups current violent like you don't where they don't even average they're out in the jungle with yeah right right so I appreciate that you take this the stance and even though I think most people are giving her a pass on that because it's because it's left-wing rather than right-wing I think it is true that in this society that we live in people are very reactionary toward right-wing ideology is a not left-wing well you you all just ask the question you started to ask me a second ago you're like you know well in effect would you be in a vegan group you know or in a vegan roundtable that included ask yourself would you be in one that included maxi so it's a really interesting comparison and it's a really interesting question right like of the two of them obviously ask yourself is way rougher around the edges like Mexi really puts a respectable face on this stuff she looks harmless she does her hair and makeup and she speaks in this you know calm and reassuring way it's hard to believe she's threatened everyone and you know with ask yourself you get you know we get a lot of Sturm and wrong sorry it sort of laps it it's Jo but you know you get a lot of the agony but I think I think the truth is just like I think he still is asking himself questions you know look I think he is capable of change but I think he's capable of reconsidering you know his deep-seated assumptions and opinions even about racism which is all stuff I've really confronted about really debated with him and I've had some kind of impact on the guy it's obvious you know it did matter to him you know my opinions and I raised issues and concerns and questions he never thought about before so it's funny of the two of them I don't think I'm hurt without their fun you know I that's easier to say though that's easy to say you know in the future it's easy for me to imagine yourself really making progress maybe precisely because he is so rough around the edges whereas I see someone like Maxie just being you know very comfortable in her position of you know how am I gonna say it you know she's having her cake and eating it too I mean when it's convenient for her to present herself as just a moderate leftist she does and when it's convenient for her to present herself as a hardline communist in favor of you know People's War class war Maoist revolutionary methods and even current you know guerrilla fighters would have you she she can do that to my life communism has not come up in my life really until I moved to show that yeah so this is probably you know just ignorant question you know like she calls people comrade and really does call people comrade it's true that is you've noticed why are you been living in China has anyone called you comrade I don't think so no but in the next light footage that we watched it was translating it into like so when when the actor uh sorry famous silent film actor Charlie Chaplin when he was put on trial in effect for being communist he was at least questioned by the authority he didn't quite get to trial what is the question they actually went through the records of him and took out every time he used the word calm yeah anybody Quito they asked him to walk it no no just in in public lectures in real life and political coordination so in this contra fir to this guy is comrade that's kind of yeah yeah because it is so before communism it was just a normal word of the English language it was just come we still have worked like camaraderie and so on but no it has become a distinctive sign of communism yeah right yeah anyway did you ever question to that what no yeah I was just like you know that is identifying yourself with this you know I don't know if there's a parallel term and waiter don't write like you know you know it just it does identify yourself as being a part of this ideology that even if you say you're not you don't you know identify yourself with it right well you know when she does yeah III assume she's being sincere when obviously she says she has misgivings about totalitarian bureaucratic rihanna's on mmm so do i but I'm not a communist I'm also not making excuses for them and so on you know I really do wish these people the best I mean it's possible she could ask yourself these questions and do some research and a merger to the other end of this rabbit hole but again you know so the other channel finished bullsh Bolshevik if you're looking at that in context it's totally reasonable for me to ask these questions and this is a very clear red flag and yes she does refer to finish Bolshevik as comrade and everyone else that's not guilt by association but that really is the context within which you refer to herself as a communist and a Marxist Leninist taking more salonist approaches like Donald Trump is taken crap recently because he retweeted videos from somebody in the UK who's a fascist yeah so in the same way if you're like if you were collaborating or associating yourself with other groups other people that are you know proclaiming one ideology or I think though I mean you know in terms of the asymmetry between the right and the left on this most people are just willing to concede without investigating at all that somehow there's a kernel of the original pure communist philosophy that's good and well intentioned and that it's it's me that it's merely you know covered with the dirt of history like like at the bar there was a diamond and they started rolling it down a muddy slope and then by the end the diamond was covered with mud but there's still a diamond in there that's that people are willing to concede that with not even Wikipedia level reading right yeah you little design what no no I was just gonna say like recently I have heard that like like I said you know yeah like it communism hasn't been something that I'm knowledgeable about but like a couple of my friends I was just recently like like in touch with them and yeah sorry sorry dude it's really just one that like she seems to have communist beliefs and we're just like where is this coming from I think it's maybe it really is like Facebook yeah most people choose some religion ideological Facebook these days she gets it from tumblr I think yeah you know oh yeah right okay tumblr rather than Facebook sorry my mom or willing to say things on tumblr than they are on Facebook because of anonymity I guess yeah well I was gonna say I really feel the other way about it but I'm someone who really has read and studied Commerce philosophy like it's not the core it's the mud and the outside I can see some value in I was just saying you a minute ago like so we're living right now in China the reality of what China is today I can totally understand someone respecting it so let's say you're from Angola in Africa today you're in Angola and you look at China and you think okay we can learn something for this guy not from communist philosophy not from the Cultural Revolution the Great Leap Forward not from Mao Zedong not from the violent not from the period before 1949 not from the horrible violence in the decades after no but you can learn from what China is today as a totally corrupt totally capitalist country with a communist dictatorship you know on top on the top of the pyramid right that I understand that would be one of the things to the bottom of the hill you say wow the mud on the outside this is pretty good you know that makes sense to me that I could respect and that would be a moderate position even though I think anymore you spent time in China thinks wow this this country's got a lot right you've done a lot right why can't you guys have freedom of the press free speech elections why can't you meet the minimum standards other countries meet why can't you replace that agitator ship on the top with something else you know I you know would but it's really a totally false object because in my opinion the philosophy of the core of it it really is poison that's why it's so jarring to communist I even remember Slava Dziedzic talking about this so a name of the moment but you know a lot of Communists they feel that Stalin was evil but then the earlier period with Lenin was morally good so this is one of many things and then when I say to them I've mentioned this recently on my channel I said well you said well do you know that they actually had elections in 1917 and you know what happened after right right and lennie the side no oh that's that's another whole story hunting down a murder me Trotsky yeah that goes on and on no no no it wasn't Trotsky ran against him in two elections the party that won the elections was called the socialist revolutionary party who are a far left-wing party and then the Bolsheviks hunted down and murdered everyone elected to Parliament their fellow left wingers the socialist because they were much more threatened by people who were their competition on the far left then they were by people who were right-wing or centrist or Democrats or so those were the people that really wanted to murder where they kept the competition but Lenin lost the elections he didn't win and then he canceled the elections they actually Parliament met once they had one day of meeting and then he started hunting down and killing everyone in Parliament and on a village by village basis he wrote about this in 1920 they started killing every one of the villages who supported any of the other parties which was of course the vast majority of the population because in most of these areas like less than 5% of people voted for the Bolsheviks and they knew that because they had the poll results so they were persecuting and murdering the other 95% it's it's really that extreme anyway but what was when you see that someone who has that view where they feel there's this diamond in the mud right and they were thinking that Lenin was pure and then later Stalin was impure then they're like it's not always but one response that sometimes you just get shock and disbelief you get people who don't want to accept that but then they just try to go back to the earlier period what's like oh well the period with with Marx and angles like the period before line end you know that was good and then you start breaking down whoa you know do you know what they actually said about the french revolution revolution good well it's simply what they praise cuz again like I can't say there's nothing good about the French Revolution but when Marx and Engels liked it but the French Revolution was was the great terror as it's known to everyone else was the persecution and massacre of people the cutting off the heads of aristocrats being right about it very clearly they wanted that to go further that's their model of social change they don't they don't find the best part of the French Revolution the best part of the French Revolution is basically just people sitting down and writing a new constitution a new Declaration of Rights and saying that slavery is bad like yes slavery is bad unfortunately the French Revolution concludes with Napoleon taking over and legalizing slavery again you know there are there are some things you can really respect especially the early days of revolution but what Marx and angles are responding to what they're enthusiastic about is the worst element of the French Revolution and that really played out in history played in the history of Russia but in history of Europe and also played out in the history of China here where they imitated those principles where we really had mass murder you know in in in imitation yeah once you're saying in Cambodia people were saying that same excuse like well if we would have kept murdering people yes it would have kept doing what Yeah right it comes ultimately the mentality comes straight out of Marx and angles because they're feeling what the French Revolution was in this late period the great terror period that if only it had gone further if only it had it had kept going and it didn't have this this reactionary tendency that people wanted to stop massacring people that that that it would have succeeded and that's right then even when you look at Cambodia you know in the 1970s and pathetically the attitude well sorry doesn't even end 1970s and 80s and 90s because the Khmer Rouge they cease to control the capital but they keep murdering people it's really really a sad history right up until they're there their reign of terror ends when um Bill Clinton is in power amazingly um anyway but you know and their attitude sincerely is if only they had kept killing more people then like utopia was just around the corner you know just a few more years of mass starvation and mass murder and utopia is just over though but look at ask another question um at what point does a word get discredit just the word come talk about thanks doc you know the history time onething but like at what point would you stop using that label because it's killed too many people like even even if you believe those even if you sincerely believe those are misinterpretations and what would you see you know what this is a little bit too susceptible to misinterpretation when do you when do you hit that point because like for real you know I am I am anti-catholic I am the world's harshest [ __ ] critic of the Catholic Church for exactly the same reason like at what point you say the Catholic Church is discredit zone it's killing millions of people look at what it did to the native people in Canada and I'm Canadians that matters to me especially but look what Catholic Church did all around the world look what it did in small Polynesian islands you know look what it did within Italy look what it I Roland Ireland has really [ __ ] up by Catholicism too I mean that that's a different kind of remote island you know I mean completely [ __ ] the Catholics destroyed Ireland what can I tell you you know there's a great documentary by the way okay it's not that great is it okay documentary called sex and a cold climate and it's just oh my god so depressing and you know it includes sexual it includes specific sexual misconduct by the Catholic Church but also just raises the general question of how like all of Ireland is like mentally and psychologically crippled but the sexual politics of Catholicism you know what I mean anyway you know at what point at what point do you just decide you know the word you know the term National Socialist most off the previous the Nazi it's kind of been discredited guys like still the term communist I mean at this point I'm sorry I just I just don't get it and I struggled I wish you know in Canada was really a problem the Green Party is [ __ ] up well what are you gonna do is start the maroon party like it so it's a real problem you can run out of words sometimes it's a real creative challenge I don't want the term veganism that's one of the reasons I came on YouTube in the first place criticizing people I don't want people like Gary Yourofsky to discredit the word veganism I don't want durianrider to describe the review I don't want to have to get a new word I'm defending that label but I'll tell you something at some point I mean if the word veganism is associated with the kind of atrocities communism is listed with I'll get rid of the term I'm gonna come up with a new label no the same way I like if people that you know if a lot of people who are vegan are communist then yeah yeah blackening the name annoy it's true I I don't remember any other YouTube channel talking about that before I came on but like really saying look guys veganism is not left-wing and I got I got a ton of feedback you know positive and negative and just a dude with like oh gee you know that never the you know veganism is also not yoga you know what I mean like I'm just saying veganism has to be separated from some of the accretions some of the cultural associations that have been that have been attached to it but yeah they so with it in the case of veganism it's the exact opposite I do think it's the diamond I don't think it's the other stuff the core idea is what I really think is positive and good and but know if it gets associated with far left-wing politics and that was that was the whole argument if the intersectional people that was what they wanted they actively wanted to Sassoon subsume pardon me subsumed veganism within left-wing politics it's like no to me this is fundamentally you know I don't even want I don't even want veganism to be subsumed within the the you know animal rescue paradigm or the me know like even that even some closely related things and animal rights I have to say no this is not the same and it's not the same as taking care of stray paths or whatever you know we really need to separate and say veganism is just so you know yeah but look on the other hand I've said before to you this is a challenge for me I think it's a challenge gonna have all my life if you really believe that veganism is for everybody then that also means it's for people you disagree with so that means you're you know it's also for Mexi and it's also for these these right-wing people and and what have you and that's that's a struggle run out of all our lives right right you remember the video I did making fun of the Holocaust the Holocaust and iron guy the vegan Holocaust and I remember him yeah I think he's in Shanghai that guy I know last I heard he was a chiang mai hopefully we might bump into him at Jame I hope not but yeah um you know in that case my response to him I just you know I don't take him seriously at all you know it's it to me that's it's a laughing matter you know put it that way you can see I spotted to it seriously I was harshly condemning what he said but you know to me I don't think that obviously that guy just glanced around the internet so but I mean you know just keep it by him with somebody like Maxie I'm not doing them to the service of thinking they don't know what they're talking about I'm taking it seriously to that extent if this person says in the internet that this is their political position and you know yeah III really believe in freedom of speech she has the right to come on the internet and make her pitch to play some kind of leadership role in the vegan movement and she's doing a better job than durianrider she's like really that's the real comparison that's the alternative people that people look at her people look at privileged vegan and then people look at people like you know they look at durianrider and they look at someone like a natural vegan I mean a natural vegan is not providing any leadership for the vegan moment she could but you know I miss very strange things I said she's not looking for community she's not looking for anyone yeah I don't you know deal is she just makes money out of YouTube apparently I mean she's not she's done the Reston activism period I think she's not interested in organizing anything so okay fine that's you know but I mean you know someone like Maxie I really respect her right to step up and try to play a leadership role I really do I don't even know what her PhD in is in but she's apparently getting a PhD and so on so she you know she may be in a position that I can only say the same thing I'd say but ask yourself who share this conversation you know who's flirted with far right-wing stuff who's flirted with racist stuff and so um but he doesn't really know what he's doing you know I hope you do the math I hope you do the reading I hope you think this all the way through I hope you keep questioning your assumptions and I hope that at the end of that process you're a better person that you are today because who you are today and what you worked des is a sack of [ __ ]